In a little over two weeks from now, Republicans will pick their candidate and the race will be on.
While presumptive GOP nominee Bill Haslam has been neglecting his duties as Mayor of Knoxville and flitting around the state on private jets, Mike McWherter has been out working hard, literally, shoveling mulch, busing tables, and installing HVAC equipment to get to know Tennessee's small business owners and listening to their concerns.
McWherter has kept his media powder dry, while Haslam has spent over $7 million trying to convince Republicans and teabaggers that he's just as crazy as Wamp or Ramsey. That's more than Gov. Bredesen spent on his primary and general election campaigns combined in 2006. And Haslam's only just getting warmed up.
McWherter has a head start and is using it to his advantage. The more I learn about him the more I like him. (See Tom Humphrey's "day on the campaign trail" article from yesterday.) Sure, he's said some things that don't sit well with progressives. Just like Harold Ford Jr. But our advice to Democrats is to put away the knives and get behind our guy. Unless you want a less qualified, less accomplished Bob Corker clone running the state.
At the end of the day, Mike McWherter will work for the working people of Tennessee, not big corporations and special interests.
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McWherter post
You're a McWherter guy, I'm a Haslam guy. While we may differ politically in some cases, I generally have high regard for you and what you write.
But I have to take issues with your last paragraph:
At the end of the day, Mike McWherter will work for the working people of Tennessee, not big corporations and special interests.
I have seen nothing in Bill Haslam's administration that would make me believe he has worked for anything but the citizen's who electd him. Twice.
And trying to portray Haslam as a rich guy and McWherter as a working class guy doesn't carry. McWherter owns a bank. One that took federal bailout money. He gave his own campaign $1,000,000 of his own money. (More than twice as much as Haslam)
Fact is a lot of Democrats will view Haslam the way a lot of Republicans view Bredesen: smart, business savvy and someone who will make smart decisions.
Plenty of differences between the two...but wealth is certainly not one of them. And we know how Haslam will govern because he's already got experience.
Mike, we're cool (I hope)
Mike, we're cool (I hope) despite our obvious differences of opinion.
Just one thing: Five Points Plaza
And a question: Who is (was) BDT Development?
Anyway, thanks for the preview of how it's going to play out.
Yes, we're cool...
Absolutely we're cool.
Five Points is an interesting case. On one hand, it went against basic economics: a grocery store will locate when grocers see a chance to make a profit. But sometimes you make a government investment without expecting a return...such as parks, greenways etc. That part of town needed retail and groceries so a slew of people: city, county, feds, private businesses...they call combined to make it happen. It didn't work out, but it was probably worth the try. I saw a similar type deal in Nashville, involving as I recall a Winn-Dixie on 12th Avenue South, end about the same way.
My understand at the time was that BDT development was headed by Leroy Thompson, the former Austin East and NFL player. But I don't know much for sure.
Thompson is the only listed
Thompson is the only listed partner now, but at the time it was also Bob Talbot, as in Holrob Construction, and if I recall correctly listed the same address (which has also since been changed).
Talbott
Tablott is a good guy. He may have been a partner...he may have mostly been offering Leroy advice and place to house himself and get advice from folks around Holrob with experience. Not sure, but I know some people work deals like that with Bob. I've known Talbott for years, both as a friend and now as both a UT Trustee (my youngest son is about to start his junior year) and head of the Boy Scouts Council where I help out with PR. (I'm an Eagle and it was one of the better expereinces of my life. They couldn't be more wrong on gay issues and I have said so, but they are overall a positive influence on kids).
Haslam's negatives need to be discussed.
I will definitely vote for Mike McWherter.
This is because Bill Haslam has taken the low road, wandered off the path of good governance for ALL the people of Tennessee. I was hoping he would not slide into the muck, rabid hatred and TEA PARTY B-S.
First, he gave a speech about a month ago giving his 'ideas' and solutions to help bring quality to Tennessee's public education system:
He mentioned setting up 'charter schools', allowing 'parent choice' and/or home schooling. This is an indirect description of Bush's NCLB...charter schools are PRIVATE schools, and parent choice means parents would put their children in these private schools (giving low income families "vouchers" to attend. Then after the end of the voucher period, if parents do not have money, the kids are transferred back to public schools. This 'plan' will do nothing to help our schools grow, but will take tax dollars out and invest in expensive private schools.
Then he went to Gatlinburg and sucked up...like the other 2 Stooges, to the TEA PARTY bunch. I can see it now: "No more government in my life". "Obama is a Nazi...a murderer..."Go home to Kenya"....yep, I can see it all at Bill's Inauguration! How damned embarrassing!
And making commercials in total support of the Arizona, profiling, racist, illegal LAW to force all our immigrants to just 'go home'...so ignorant. Count on it...he won't be recruiting new TN businesses...especially those owned by foreign corporations, owned by Latinos, Muslims, Blacks, nope.
And the last objection is his intent to endorse teaching ID along with evolution in public schools. This would be a violation of the First Amendment...freedom from religion!
I had listened to some young professionals here who kept saying Bill Haslam was 'above all that GOP right wing mess. Obviously he is not.
Mike McWherter has real ideals to create jobs, grow the economy and work on TN's education needs. All the other three do is insult each other, with rumors, lies, and whining.
charter schools are PRIVATE
Without getting into this whole issue again, just want to note that this is not true. Whatever their pros or cons, charter schools are explicitly public schools in every state I know of that has charter school legislation.
Most of them are not managed
Most of them are not managed by corporations. I think that's about 15 percent of the total, tho I haven't seen recent numbers. The vast majority are run by non-profit boards of one kind or another. Lots of states don't even allow for-profit management, including Tennessee. The Tennessee law says it right up front:
There are legitimate things to argue about with charter schools, including how much of a difference they really make to educational outcomes. But they are not private schools, and they are mostly not run by for-profit contractors. They are mostly (and, in Tennessee, exclusively) public schools under independent, non-profit management.
A nonprofit board operating a
A nonprofit board operating a public school under charter to a public school board is just an alternative management model. It is actually less "corporate" in its character (in the sense of bureaucratic, top-down authoritarianism) than your normal public school structure, which is pretty fascistic itself in a lot of ways. Most charter schools are independent. They are not part of some chain or franchise system, for-profit or otherwise.
Again, there are legitimate discussions to be had about the pros and cons of charter schools. But those discussions do not, in most places (including Tennessee) revolve around privatization or corporatization.
Sure it's bound by a social
Sure it's bound by a social contract. It's bound by a literal contract, the charter itself, which is subject to approval, review, renewal or revocation by a public body (usually a local school board, sometimes a state board of education). There's nothing magical (or magically consensual) about the current way public education is set up. Ask any parent who's ever had a fight over school zones, special-ed services, classroom placement, etc etc.
As to how charter schools handle disputes, what kind of disputes do you mean? In general, they are given the authority to handle parent or teacher conflicts internally, within varying parameters.
The redress issue is no
The redress issue is no different than in a normal public school. Just a different body. And I'm not aware of any requirement that anybody seek arbitration or mediation first, in either regular public schools or charter schools. (Well, that's not completely true. In special ed cases, under federal law, I think the first step is always for the local school team to try to address whatever the problem is. But that doesn't preclude later litigation, as reams of special-ed lawsuits indicate.)
As for your anecdote, I think you're misattributing the problem to being related to the charter. Public school systems are required to provide necessary services for special-education students, but they are not required to provide every possible service at every single school. If a service or resource is not available at one school, they are required to provide transportation to a school that offers the service. If there isn't one, they are required to provide transportation to a service provided elsewhere, and to pay for it too. (Which is where you get those rare cases of school systems paying $50,000 a year or whatever for one student.) But there's nothing that says one particular service has to be available at one particular school, whether that school is a charter school or not.
I don't know all the specifics of the case you're talking about, but I don't think it's probably a charter-school issue per se.
And anyway, what's all this
And anyway, what's all this argument-by-anecdote?
:)
That's not true, charter
That's not true, charter schools aren't allowed to discriminate against special-ed students, any more than any other public school. That's federal civil rights law, states and municipalities (which oversee charter schools) can't opt out of it. Again, that doesn't mean that every school has to provide every service. The division of responsibility varies, but here's a good overview of how Tennessee is set up. Basically, since charter schools here are considered part of the local school system, there is a division of responsibility between the school and the broader school district. In states with "stronger" charter laws -- i.e., charter schools are more or wholly independent of local school systems -- the charter schools have to provide more or all of the needed services themselves. There are arguable pluses and minuses to doing it either way. In general I'd say forcing any one school to provide the entire range of special-ed evaluation and educational resources would be a pretty big burden.
As for arbitration and mediation, again I'm not aware of any structural or legal differences in how charter schools handle disputes vs. how other public schools handle them. If you have any info on it, I'd be happy to read it.
Fair enough. As long as
Fair enough. As long as people stop calling charter schools private or for-profit, I won't have to keep correcting them.
There's nonprofit and then
There's nonprofit and then there's "nonprofit."
Sorry to drag this out, but
Sorry to drag this out, but look, I understand you're a skeptic. All I can say is that the Tennessee law specifically requires charter schools to be run by 501(c)3 nonprofit sponsors. Policing exactly who those sponsors are will be up to local school boards, who will be in charge of approving, renewing, and revoking charters.
And in re: Metulj, I'm not sure where you're coming from with the whole "parents have to sign a contract" thing, but parents enrolled in charter schools actually have MORE rights than parents in other schools, because since they're there voluntarily they can withdraw at any time and return to their locally-zoned school. And the Tennessee law specifically states that parents enrolled in charter schools do not waive any of the normal parental rights they have under state and federal laws.
Charter schools are not some trojan horse. They just aren't. The laws aren't written that way. They're not a magic answer either. But I wish liberal/progressive types weren't so quick to defend the existing public school model. It's really not a very good model -- and really not a very "progressive" one either -- and there are lots of possible better ways to do things.
The governing body of a
The whole law is here.
And of course the form of management matters. But which forms are best? Part of the point is to allow experimentation (within certain parameters).
Would you guys please start a
Would you guys please start a thread on charter schools? I keep coming here to read about McWherter v. Haslam and finding your discussion instead.
Gracias.
Well, I'm not for Haslam
But I'm not for McWherter, either. Look, he is a nice man, and I like him personally.
However, if he continues to chase the votes of people who will not vote for him and keeps tacking to the right, there's no reason for me to vote for him, especially if Haslam is the nominee. If Wamp or Ramsey pull the upset, then I would reconsider.
As I noted in my post this weekend, my vote will not be taken for granted. Mike needs my vote a hell of a lot more than I need to vote for Mike; I can write in Mabel. Haslam will be the Republican Bredesen, he will frustrate the right-wingers as much as Bredesen frustrated us.
He's got to show me that he WANTS my vote and that he NEEDS my vote and he's got to court me, not just say "Get in the truck, ho!".
Ok, rant over, thanks for letting me vent!
Couldn't agree more
I loved your post and I couldn't agree with you more.
We accurately accuse the
We accurately accuse the reich-wing of being short-sighted, of persuing short-term profits at the expense of long-term economic health.(not to mention at the expense national security and physical health.) But this is a pretty clear example of the Left doing the same thing. A Haslam win will strengthen the national republican party. It will be cited as evidence that Americans are trending reich-wing. It will be cited as reasoning to do all manner of idiotic crap that simply does not well serve the long term needs of the nation or the world. I have met and interacted with Bill Haslam. Even though I supported his opponent in the initial mayoral contest, I have been fairly impressed with his performance as mayor. This isn't about him. As long as he places an "r" after his name, his election will only hasten this nation's slide into irrelevancy or pariah status, which ever comes first. It will help hinder or prevent any social advancements being made within this nation. It might MIGHT be good for TN but only at the expense of the good of the nation and the physical health of the citizenry.
If the only thing the election of Mike McWherter does is send a message to the Right that their childishness and uninformed ways will no longer be tolerated by the citizens of TN, it is well worth getting out and voting for him. To view this as simply a question of the differences between Mike and Bill or Mike and Zach would be as short-sighted as anything the republicans have done in the last couple of decades.
"As long as he places an "r"
"As long as he places an "r" after his name, his [Haslam's] election will only hasten this nation's slide into irrelevancy or pariah status, which ever comes first. It will help hinder or prevent any social advancements being made within this nation. It might MIGHT be good for TN but only at the expense of the good of the nation and the physical health of the citizenry."
I disagree. The political punditocracy will indeed count a Haslam win here as having some sort of implication about the national Republican party immediately following election day, but they'll move on quickly, as soon as the next shiny object offers another narrative for them to follow.
In truth, the more reasonable, thoughtful Republicans get through, the more the right wing fringe will get marginalized. The same is true in the opposite direction as well. People like Bredesen and Haslam are good for this state and the country because they govern based on pragmatism and an understanding of reality, not rigid partisanship. This state and country need more of that, not less.
I would love for you to be
I would love for you to be right. If you would just provide me with a couple of valid examples of moderate(thoughtful? considerate? compassionate?) republicans effectively moving the direction of their party off of its hellbound track, I will happily concede. But to my memory, post Teddy, post Ike, post Nixon, each more "right" than the predecessor, things went more rightwing.
I imagine that there is some potential for your theory to have validity in a small enough population. It may well be true for the city of Knoxville. It does not appear to be true for the county of Knox. It is a great theory and it would give me hope for the nation if it really worked that way but, I'm not seeing it. Hopefully you will be able to demonstrate where/how I am being blinded by cynicism.
People like Howard Baker and
People like Howard Baker and Alan Simpson have certainly been moderating forces within the Republican Party. I'm not talking about finding folks who would turn their party into the Republican wing of the Democratic party. I am talking about people who will work with others of opposing views and seek reasonable solutions. Baker certainly did that. Simpson even did a collegial point-counterpoint radio show with Ted Kennedy back in the day.
Right now the Tea Party gang wants to control things and to have 'purity tests' for public figures. Sarah Palin ably represents their emphasis on posturing over policy. There are a lot of Republicans who don't want any part of that. It's a mistake to believe that party labels represent monolithic viewpoints. It would also be a mistake, particularly in the case of a governorship, to support one candidate or the other simply because he represents a partisan check mark in the national score sheet. The only time a governor's party really has any effect on the national scene is if he gets to appoint a senator. Without heading over to google, do you even know which party currently holds more governor's offices? I don't, because it's not very important on the national stage. If you were voting for a senate seat, it would be different, because that can make for a fundamental shift of power for the whole country. The governorship just doesn't do that.
To all appearances, Haslam is
To all appearances, Haslam is to McWherter's left. Is McWherter actually more accomplished than Haslam? Business experience is a wash. By all accounts, Haslam has done a pretty good job as mayor and running his campaign. Meanwhile, McWherter has demonstrated that he knows absolutely nothing about anything.
Humphrey and the Nashville City Paper's Haslam profiles have made me a lot more comfortable with him. Meanwhile, profiles of McWherter just make him seem like an idiot.
This has absolutely nothing to do with the national GOP (which is going to win big regardless of what happens in TN), and everything to do with the management of the state, which has ACTUAL problems. Nothing I've seen from McWherter suggests he can handle anything, and there is absolutely no ideological reason to support him.
This has absolutely nothing
I understand that this represents your experiences and opinion. It does not represent mine. I have discussed (argued) politics in several countries and several states. I have personally heard gubernatorial, state and local elections held up as proof of the overall embrace of reich-wing ideology. This election has everything to do the national direction of our nation. In short, you are wrong.
Other than that, I am in agreement with Mr Neal. McWherter has said some things I find repulsive but overall I am reasonably confident in his intent and abilities. It is great political sport but there is no established validity in the idea that being a mayor makes you qualified to be a governor or that it is demonstrative of how you will govern. There are differences in the charters and/or constitutions of the entities and of course, there are huge differences between a city council/county commission and a state legislature. Private executive experience is not an indicator of how one might perform as executive in a democracy environment. Political rhetoric over the last several years has been unfortunately effective of convincing the populace of imaginary shit. Unrelated experiences as indicators of public performance may be the ultimate in imaginary politics.
You are certainly free to believe whatever any politician or political campaign tells you but that will not make it true.
I will be getting behind
I will be getting behind McWherter myself, if only to position myself most effectively to kick him in the ass when he gets out of line.
And CAFKIA, you have been around long enough to know that no matter the outcome, it's always good news for Republicans.
One of the more interesting themes come November, as this election slides to its inevitable Haslam-McWherter matchup, is to see which legacy is more appealing to the voters of Tennessee. The embedded Good-Ole-Boy networks in a battle royale for the governor's office, and whose favored son will prevail......
I know this is asking a lot,
I know this is asking a lot, but it would be easier for me to get enthusiastic about any of the candidates if there was a single one of them with a decent position on gay rights. That's about as close as I come to single-issue voting, except for the small problem that there is so rarely a candidate for any office who's not either obviously bigoted or at least willing to pander to bigotry. As far as I can tell, McWherter does not distinguish himself at all on that count.
Like I said before, that
Like I said before, that candidate dropped out to run for mayor of Clarksville. Another one dropped out before that because Democrats accused him of being a Republican in disguise.
I know. It's just
I know. It's just disheartening, is all.
Good points
Especially about Kim; her very candidacy was a threat to the good-ole-boy network, even if she was barely to the left of Philly B. That's why they rallied to make sure she couldn't raise any money.
I just get mighty damn tired of being told (not by YOU) by the state party to shut up and get in line behind some barely-to-the-left-of-the-Republicans good ole boy that they anoint.
At the end of the day, if Wamp or Ramsey pulls the upset, I'll leave the McWherter sign in my yard. If it's haslam, I will have to think about it.
Mabel still is my favorite, at the end of the day! :)
To point out the obvious,
To point out the obvious, though this particular candidate may not have the position you want, clearly having the state and the nation trend "left" makes it much more likely that rights for all will become the law of the land.
I'm as guilty as anyone of wanting it all and wanting it now. However, there is enough of the pragmatist in me to know that wholesale and immediate change after years (decades, centuries, millenia) is not likely and, in some cases, may not be desirable.
Maybe. I mean, I know the
Maybe. I mean, I know the argument. But look, Bill Clinton's presidency gave us both the terrible Don't Ask/Don't Tell, and the even worse Defense of Marriage Act. Granted, he proposed the former as at least a half-step in the right direction, but it didn't turn out that way. And the latter was a Republican bill that he felt compelled to sign. But it's not actually clear that having Democrats in control of executive or legislative branches has really done much for gay rights -- partly because it's an easy issue for them to use to distance themselves from the "left" of their own party and show how moderate and centrist they are.
And I single that issue out not because I think it's more important than economic, environmental, or other concerns, but just because a.) it's so clearly black-and-white to me, as a moral issue, in a way that not many other things are; and b.) because of the current political landscape, it requires real courage to take a strong stand in favor of gay rights, so I respect anyone of any party who does.
Anyway. I know if I make that a make-or-break issue, I won't have any actual candidates to vote for in Tennessee. I'm not happy about it, is all.
A rose by any other name
But it should be make-or-break; civil rights are civil rights, period. I can't fathom thinking that a little bit of bigotry is OK, as long as the candidate has a "D" by his name.
I cannot allow myself to vote for that weasel.
[EDIT:] Y'all go read Aunt B.
But it should be
But it should be make-or-break; civil rights are civil rights, period.
That's an excellent point.
In fact, maybe Democrats in Tennessee and everywhere else should read and abide by the official Democratic National Committee Platform or quit calling themselves Democrats.
It says:
Yes. That would be nice.
Yes. That would be nice.
That is indeed an impressive
That is indeed an impressive statement. Makes you wonder what that statement read like when Clinton was pres.
Why in the hell did he sign DOMA? And why do so many dems support DOMA still?
They have to know that history will judge them harshly on this.
Unless you want a less
Unless you want a less qualified, less accomplished Bob Corker clone running the state.
I haven't yet decided who to vote for. I want to vote for McWherter, but he's got to show me he's actually a Democrat first.
And honestly, as unhappy as I am with Corker most of the time, I regret ever casting a vote for that slimy Harold Ford. I should have just stayed at home.
You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but I prefer Haslam over Corker any day. Haslam has learned a lot of things in office about listening to different constituencies and trying to move toward consensus. I don't think Corker gets that, although executive and legislative jobs are vastly different.
I'll be voting for McWherter...
I won't consider voting for Haslam because of that stupid campaign ad of his that panders to the worst of the worst sentiments of the Tea-Baggers when he praises the State of Arizona immigration law.
I don't care if he doesn't really mean it or not...to put that kind of campaign ad out there is reprehensible and evil. Even if he were to veto every instance of a similar law in Tennessee that came before him as governor to sign, just the fact that he pandered to those base emotions in the bigoted, low-information, low-education voters of Tennessee to win an election pisses me off to no end.
If McWherter were to come up with a similar statement as one of his campaign talking points, I would have to refrain from voting altogether. Or conversely consider writing myself in as my vote...
So far, I haven't heard of him saying crap like that. If he has, please put it here so I can take a look at it. Is McWherter as liberal as I would like him to be? No. But he's a damn sight better than any of the Republicans running.
just the fact that he
I had a message on the answering machine last night from a kindly sounding gent named Thurmond assuring me that Haslam would not grab my guns. I bet I have received 4 or 5 pieces of mail from the Haslam campaign within the last two weeks, all touting his conservative cred.
Those pandered to will expect results.
Can't vote for McWherter. He
Can't vote for McWherter. He has already defended the Arizona immigration law, Talidapali. He's got reservations about teaching our children evolution. He thinks gays would sexually abuse their adopted children, or something, who knows, but he's morally against it. All, each one, is a deal-breaker. I thought I was a yellow-dog Democrat, but MM's too much for me. Can any of you honestly vote for someone who doesn't want evolution taught in our schools? Come on!
hadn't heard all that about him...
got any links to those statements? I may have to write myself in.
I encourage everyone to go
I encourage everyone to go here:
(link...)
and click on McWherter and Haslam and go through the issue tabs. I'll concede there's not much difference on substantive issues, except maybe election of constitutional officers, mountaintop removal mining, pre-k, the health care reform bill, court challenge to the health care reform bill, TennCare expansion, open gun permit records, guns in bars, guns on campus, federal v. state gun laws, English only, abortion, Planned Parenthood funding, same-sex couple adoption, inheritance tax, Hall tax, voting rights (proof of citizenship), candidate financial disclosure, fundraising during legislative sessions, and eliminating state government departments.
On the evolution question, I believe McWherter misspoke during the debate. I think his answer to the above questionnaire was what he meant to say. But I'll also concede that it's not very good politicking to misspeak in an important debate.
I'll hold my nose and vote McWherter
That does pretty well sum it up.
I'll hold my nose and vote McWherter in the general regardless of whether its Wamp or Haslam against him.
Haslam's statement on Mountaintop removal is the essence of wafflyness.
Dreaming...A Republican Party spinoff issues a platform like...
Though it was written 98 years ago, with some significant changes, the Progressive Party Platform works for me today. At the risk of coining a phrase, "I have a dream."