McCain certainly needs to score on economic issues, but I don't see that dueling tax plans with Obama (as they did last debate) is going to get him there.

Brian A.
I'd rather be cycling.

That's two "I know hows"

NOw 3

Oh nasty! I'm not Bush!

acorn = $100 + Ayres ?(didn't hear exactly)

Obama is elegant in his treatment of the question on Ms. Palin's qualifications.

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McCain finally "took the gloves off." His attack, however, was so disjointed and out of context of the discussion that I don't know that it was all that effective--assuming those points are persuasive.

I'm not sure how many voters outside of the rightist talk radio crowd followed what McCain was trying to say.

By the way, if candidates get style points on the likeability/who-do-you-want-to-have-a-beer-with scale, they are mostly going to Obama. Is it my imagination, or does McCain almost look mad?

Brian A.
I'd rather be cycling.

Yes, McCain just mentioned Ayres by name and cost me $100. But he also just lost the election with his embarrassingly irrational attack, so it's $100 well spent.

P.S. ACORN is "destroying the fabric of democracy?" WTF?

Did I miss something? If Mr. McCain is imposing a spending freeze, where does he get the money for 45 Nukes?

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Is it my imagination or has Schieffer's questions but an improvement over previous moderators?

And where's Grumpy's flag pin?

McCain is debating from somewhere deep inside the Twilight Zone on health care. He's responding to something he thinks Obama said in some other dimension.

McCain managed to squeeze in most of the talking points from the wingnuts' wish list. Too bad his presentation on most of them was horrible.

I don't see that kind of effort (on Ayers, ACORN, abortion, etc.) swaying many votes. It will be interesting to see if the rightists consider it to be a "home run" regardless.

Brian A.
I'd rather be cycling.

This is the 1st prez debate this year I'm still awake at the end. Obama is speaking brilliantly, McCain is stumbling and struggling. The earlier ones were closer and frankly boring.

____________________________________
"Whoever corrects a mocker invites insult; whoever rebukes a wicked man incurs abuse."

We have seen one result of McCain debate prep. Cindy appeared to be at least semi-civil to Michelle even if John couldn't remember her name.

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I think McCain was better tonight. But not better enough to change the game.

And I think he'll live to rue the day he put "health" of the mother in air quotes.

Ok, my count. He said Ayers three times and referred to him once more. So that's $100 for the Ayers reference.

He did refer to ACORN by name, so that's another $100.

He said "I know how to...." three times. $30.

No reference to POW days. Refreshing.

He said Obama was going to raise taxes AT LEAST 7 times. Frankly, I lost count. Call it $70.

That's $300 for Obama from me.

BTW, why did he keep talking about Sarah Palin and autism? Doesn't her baby have Downs'?

P.S. The spilt screen was great. McCain looked mad as hell half the time, and twice I saw him actually rolling his eyes.

Rachel, I just matched your $300.

OK, me too.

Brian's earlier remark about squeezing in the GOP talking points was spot on. I mentioned to the Mrs. that as incoherent as he was, the "base" (whoever the hell they are nowadays) heard all the code words they needed/wanted to hear to justify their vote*. Hopefully, that won't be enough.

And we both agreed that this was the best debate so far by far.

And I don't care what any polls or pundits say, Obama won it going away.

(*Although I think McCain may have lost some of his base on the abortion topic by not guaranteeing Supreme Court justices who would overturn Roe v. Wade.)

From my random other notes, I'm still mostly on the fence regarding nuclear power plants.

But when McCain says we can safely reprocess and store nuclear waste, all I can think of is Mason jars.

I already pledged to the Obama campaign for this month, and I don't really think they'll need any more from me. So I'll donate $100 to moveon.org, $100 to DSCC (or directly to Al Franken and/or other close Senate candidates), and $100 to ACORN.

Another random note. Did you notice how Obama ended his answer to the question about his running mate by saying that if something happened to him (Obama) Biden could do the job, and McCain never said that about Palin? Even McCain concedes she's an unqualified political stunt.

Somebody needs to find this Joe the Plumber guy and assign him some Secret Service protection, because he is apparently going to decide this election.

EDIT: Haha. Kleinheider already found him (or at least a reasonable facsimile).

A random Joe the Plumber is going to need a new web server. And he's probably going to be a celebrity.

Does the Obama campaign need more money?

I think Tweety made a pretty good point when he noted McCain's contradiction in trying to make a play for "Clinton supporters." At one point in the debate McCain favorably cited Clinton. But then, later in the debate he undercut this bid by making a strong anti-choice statement, which would presumably alienate them (if they are "feminists").

That's what the McCain campaign has been in a nutshell, isn't it? Part of the time he paints himself as a bipartisan maverick, but then the rest of the time he plays to the GOP base. Seems to me he's not doing a good job of winning over either one.

Brian A.
I'd rather be cycling.

Did I hear McCain refer to "Freddie Mae" in relation to the mortgage crisis? Somebody check the tape.

I thought I caught some weird gaffe from McCain in reference to Palin. Something like she's "a new breast of fresh hair" instead of "a new breath of fresh air?

Another random note. If I understood McCain's argument to Joe the Plumber correctly, Joe the Plumber should not wish to become wealthy because he might be subject to paying some extra taxes? And he should not support Obama's plans to help the middle class and small businesses succeed because it might make him wealthy and he would therefore have to pay more taxes?

This is the same McCain who lives in a make-believe world of so-called 35 percent corporate taxes that are the second highest in the world where no corporation pays that much (including mine) because of all the loopholes, credits, subsidies, and other forms of corporate welfare.

Another random note. I was surprised that McCain would tout his opposition to an American company building the next generation aerial refueler and then engineer a deal to take away American jobs and get a French company to build it.

I would explain, but someone already did, earlier today, before the debate.

Local viewers liked debate formula : Election News : Knoxville News Sentinel

Posted by lassa on October 16, 2008 at 4:44 a.m.

I am disturbed about the whole thing. I think Obama is going to have alot to do with making the whole world with one monatary system, as the Bible predicts. McCain has no chance. All you Christians out there, you know what I am talking about. We are seeing the end times, signs that Jesus told us about and to look for.

Posted by lassa on October 16, 2008 at 5:17 a.m.

Read matthew 24:1-35 and Revelation. Fascinating. We Christians are seeing these things happening now. We Christians watch and wait. Obama will win the election and will start the progress of what has been predicted in the Bible.

We recorded it but I've seen enough clips by now that I don't know if I will watch it today or not. We had Randy Newman tickets at the Bijou.

We listened to the last few minutes driving home and heard the CNN focus group go heavily for Obama. They didn't like McCain's attacks.

Randy Newman was great. He talks between songs and frankly, I wish he would play less and talk to us even more. He never actually crossed the line and talked about this election, but he came across with his obvious left lean as he chatted about the topical and political nature of his music.

Favorite song of the night? "Potholes in Memory Lane"

(link...)

(link...)

I got this e-mail which didn't reference the actual article but it is going to inflame some.

Morning Edition talked about fact checking this morning. 100% of McCain's ads negative?

Damn near.

Obama spent more than anyone in history on negative ads?

Misleading.

According to the Wisconsin Advertising Project at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, "nearly 100 percent" of the ads that McCain ran in the week of Sept. 28 to Oct. 4 were negative. Obama's ads in that week were 34 percent negative.

However, McCain was correct in saying that Obama has spent more on negative ads than he has. What McCain did not note is that Obama has spent more overall, since the Democrat opted out of the public financing system and can therefore raise unlimited amounts of funds.

Obama spent more on everything because an overwhelming number of people did something we had never done before. We donated everything we felt we could spare to help him get elected.

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. . . but it is going to inflame some

so your shirt tail didn't hit your ass before you posted it.

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My favorite NS reader comment came out of the Charter change discussion and was from Orangebbob, who said

"Why in God's mane would you want to give up your right to voet......"

Another random note. McCain complained something about spending the most money on the worst schools. Uh, where does he expect to spend the money? Does he take his car to the mechanic and spend a lot of money fixing an engine that ain't broke?

He also said something about early education not being effective, citing statistics that show third graders who received it score the same as third graders who didn't. Uh, isn't that the point? Doesn't that sort of, you know, prove that it works? Aren't most of these programs targeted at the most at-risk kids, who would already be seriously and permanently behind by the third grade otherwise?

If I understood McCain's argument to Joe the Plumber correctly, Joe the Plumber should not wish to become wealthy because he might be subject to paying some extra taxes? And he should not support Obama's plans to help the middle class and small businesses succeed because it might make him wealthy and he would therefore have to pay more taxes?

This was a puzzle to me too. McCain kept saying, "Congratulations, Joe, you're rich!" I couldn't tell whether he was being sarcastic because he thinks a plumber in Ohio who is struggling to make $250k of course can't be rich, but is being treated like he is and penalized for it? Or that Joe IS rich, but should be rewarded by getting his taxes reduced? Creepy in any case.

Another random note. Didn't they get a question on climate change? I don't remember any discussion beyond that.

An awkward choice of words was when McCain said something like "a gold plated Cadillac," in referring to elective medical treatments his plan wouldn't cover.

National Review Online:

I’m sitting there thinking, "We Republicans certainly couldn’t have Romney -- he was too smooth, too slick, too articulate, too handsome, too successful, too rich, too this, too that." Yeah, well, a little Romney might be helpful right about now.