He just never got back to us. Big difference. For all I know he'll call me back tomorrow morning wanting to send along his tax forms in the afternoon, in which case we'll post them. Just wanted to clarify that.

I'd actually argue that it's possibly more pertinent for Council candidates than mayoral ones, exactly because it's a part-time job. Council members usually (though not always) need outside sources of income, which makes them uniquely vulnerable to conflicts of interest. Yes, they do have to swear on taking office that they will avoid such conflicts. But I think having openness about their personal finances helps provide a check on that.

We also know that one year's tax summary is hardly a complete picture of someone's finances. But it's a start. And I think there's more than just conflicts to be gleaned. There's also just the basic question of who the people are who want to represent us. Their income is just one part of that, but it adds something to the pictures we already have of them.

People have asked us, what about legislative and county-level candidates? We will be asking for those, too. We will also be asking for them from sitting officeholders. I think what Cari wrote is true, people get very uncomfortable when it comes to money. I think that keeping personal finances such a taboo has helped foster illusions about the American class system, and we'd all be better served with more openness, particularly from public officials.

At the same time, I understand that there are a lot of people who have restrictions about how much they can reveal. I don't expect anyone to get fired just to satisfy the local media. But there's no reason for us not to ask.

Oh noes! MP v. SKB 2.0!

Maybe local journalists should have to disclose?

Or at least the only local "real" newspaper (as characterized in the publishing/newspaper/journalism biz).

But alas, I asked the (then new) publisher of the KNS about revenues from Pilot during the governor's election, in relation to their lack of coverage of his opposition.

Of course, they don't have to disclose that, and obviously he declined to disclose it to some "obscure liberal blog."

Anyway, carry on.

So, no substantive response from the article's author re. council disclosures. Editor vigorously defends article.

Sounds familiar.

OK, then.

It was my idea to make the requests. I was explaining the thinking to you.

Sometimes I think pissing on Metro Pulse is just a knee-jerk reaction for you. If you don't want us to answer your questions, you shouldn't ask them.

Sometimes I think pissing on Metro Pulse is just a knee-jerk reaction for you.

Feeling's mutual. Sorry I linked to your sort of interesting but somewhat poorly written story (as per all the disclaimers and backpedaling).

I should have learned the first time. I'll try to be more circumspect in the future.

???

I don't think we've ever dissed you. (I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong about that, but in any case I don't think I ever have.) I like what you do and there are a number of interesting commenters here. I don't get your weird thing with Metro Pulse -- I mean, obviously I know the history from the Conley era and everything, but that was corporately and corporeally a different publication. If you don't understand that, I don't know what I could do to persuade you.

It's true that I don't like your tendency to either misperceive or misrepresent our work (as in your comment there about "disclaimers and backpedaling," neither of which have happened in this thread). But mostly I don't know what your issue is with us.

Nobody's obliged to like us. But usually I understand why they don't. In your case, I don't get it. But that's ok. I don't need to understand everything. Just saying I find it odd, all things considered.

On the other hand, having just spent way too long going around and around with crazy #9 over the last few days, I'm really not up for another epic meta-discussion of Metro Pulse. So I'll leave it there.

Peace.

I wasn't comparing you! Sheesh. (Thicker skins might be needed on multiple fronts here.)

It's just been a tiresome week, on the online-forum front.

I agree that jfm wasn't comparing you to 9. Looked to me like he was just stating his state of mind.

Did you guys ask about declaring bankruptcy in 2011? The following is a public record. It just might be pretty important for the public to know about this.

Ronald Leon Peabody and Jamie McCann Peabody

3:11-bk-30354

Since I'm fresh from one go-around with JFM and Ms. Gervin, who told me to go to hell, I'm not getting into this one except to say that I agree with R. Neal - in the case of these candidates, the refusals are more interesting than the discloures themselves.

Randy and Jesse, I don't profess to understand this exchange at all but I would like to convey my highest regard for both of you and my disappointment to see you position yourselves in any way but "on the same team". And what a great team you two make.

Back on point: With absolutely no disrespect intended to MP, to Jesse, or to Cari...the more I think about this proposed practice of personal financial disclosures from all candidates, the more I think it fails to answer this voter's pertinent questions.

Personally, I don't feel any need to know how much money a candidate has invested here or there so much as I feel a need to know where that candidate has money invested, as in "might any conflict exist in terms of votes this candidate could be asked to render?"

Neither do I feel any need to know a candidate's salary. Maybe salary could be an indicator of a candidate's knowledge or expertise or even integrity (and maybe not), but I'm content to gauge those important qualifiers by other means, like his or her career resume of paid or even unpaid experiences.

As to Mark Padgett, whose candidacy I regret has undoubtedly fueled this practice in this locale and in this election, all I feel a need to know is by what measure I may gauge his qualification for office.

He hasn't previously held elected office, he hasn't previously worked as an employee in local government, and he hasn't previously expressed any interest in any particular civic issue or debate of which I'm aware. I don't even know of his having volunteered for any particular agency or cause (aside from political campaigns of others) remotely related to local government.

It was he, not I, who proposed that we should gauge his qualification for office on the basis of his “business acumen,” so I’m going through those motions—NOT that I think that quality alone “qualifies” him.

But so far, I’ve been unable even to locate his office. And now I have these generously-offered four years’ tax returns, each of them lacking the supporting schedules that could allow me to verify the viability of his business?

Hence my sentiment that the process failed to answer my pertinent questions—and might well cause fewer people to offer themselves as candidates in future elections, too.

For the record, and because jfm and I have been arguing about another MP story, I have to say he's right on this one.

I didn't read the story as saying Hultquist declined; I read it as saying Joe didn't get back to them before press time.

Yes, Daniel, I'd have to say that, as a voter, I attach more importance to having information like whether a candidate has declared bankrupcty than what level of income his tax return reflects.

I do say that with understanding and sympathy for people who've had to declare bankruptcy when illness, job loss, or divorce threw their lives into crisis.

I just want to know about any candidate who, when the seas were calm, was found to be incapable of managing his personal finances.

Ugh, MP posted a pdf of the Peabody's bankruptcy filing. I was scanning it, but when I got to the part where they had to list the DOG, I had to quit.

I felt like I was going through somebody's home opening all their cabinets and reading their mail. Ick.

Please God don't let this ever happen to me.

I guess if you decide to run for public office shortly after filing for bankruptcy you have to be prepared for this info to be made public, but still - ick.

(Off-topic)

Mello explains her above reference to typing "one-handed" in a private message...with lots of typos:

This past Saturday, she fell from a 24 foot extension ladder onto concrete, breaking seven bones in her arm, wrist and hand and suffering multiple fractures elsewhere (which she doesn't describe, probably because it requires too much typing).

She has surgery scheduled tomorrow (Thursday, I think she means), provided her swelling is better.

She hurts and she's sorely depressed. Thought you'd probably want to send her a "get well card," the poor thing.

I felt like I was peeking into somebody's window or something.

Nor do I care to discuss someone's personal tragedy on a public forum--no matter that I've had disagreements with that someone in the past--except to say that a couple of points in the filing evoke my sympathy and understanding.

It appears that this family has experienced illness. I notice a recent reduction in their income, coupled with several medical balances that total relatively little now, but that may be residual balances on what were formerly much higher bills.

And I find it honorable that, in their worst hour, this family chose a Chapter 13 "reorganization" over a Chapter 7 "straight bankruptcy."

this was a medical bankruptcy

That's how it appears, and it shouldn't happen in America to anybody.

Not sure how the reporter got "Possible Victim of the Housing Bubble?" from that filing, except the home was refinanced. Doesn't say what for, but does list a bunch of medical expenses.

I can understand Finbar Saunders statement, "But I’ll tell you frankly that will have a chilling effect on future elections."

Having said that, I was curious about Managed Response Inc. (MRI) listed on Madeline Rogero's TEC filing. Apparently I don't know enough about the candidate. Initially I thought it might be some sort of healthcare company. MRI is a engineering/construction project management company. Her husband either works there or worked there. They are no longer listed as a corp in TN as of 3/2011. They are based out of Texas. His resume shows he worked on local projects for ORNL, Knox County Schools (Karns Middle School), the Knoxville Juvenile Justice Center, as well as Wal-Mart expansions and a new store (Georgia, Tennessee, Kentucky) from 1992 to current.

A lot of information, although possibly limited, being provided. I wonder how the majority of voters use this information.

I wonder how the majority of voters use this information.

Unless they should happen by here to see your further research, biz, I kinda doubt the majority of voters would even catch this potential conflict for Madeline.

Having known her for over 20 years, I certainly trust her to be somebody to reveal such potential conflicts.

However, absent voters acting as you have to research candidates' disclosures further for themselves, I wonder whether these general disclosures from candidates to media "give us what we need?"

Or is it just the case that, in this particular instance, MP hasn't taken their own research of candidates' disclosures far enough to have made it useful to voters?

(I realize I'm waffling on this topic. I just can't decide if or how this financial disclosure process should be conducted...)

I didn't mean to indicate just the information about Madeline. I was trying to ask about how voters might use any of this information being vetted through the different media sources.

Yes, and I understood you were thinking about the issue more broadly.

(Have you noticed how, over the last day or two, every one of us has seemed to constantly assure and explain and affirm our "understanding" of one another, on about every thread, and that, even so, an extraordinary volume of misunderstandings seems to be arising??? I'd swear it's something in the air just recently...)

or perhaps Mars is retrograde.

Dr. Lyons, I don't think voter turn out in the City of Knoxville is low because folks find it too difficult to research candidates and their respective positions on the issues; I think much of it has to do with interest and the fact City elections are held in odd years. Were the City elections held with other elections, the turnout would be far greater.