Nice values displayed at the Values Voter Summit. Be sure to go to the link for the lovely picture.
Activists at a conservative political forum snapped up boxes of waffle mix depicting Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama as a racial stereotype on its front and wearing Arab-like headdress on its top flap.
On the back of the box, Obama is depicted in stereotypical Mexican dress, including a sombrero, above a recipe for "Open Border Fiesta Waffles" that says it can serve "4 or more illegal aliens." The recipe includes a tip: "While waiting for these zesty treats to invade your home, why not learn a foreign language?"
Asked if he considered the pictures of Obama on the box to be racial stereotypes, Whitlock said: "We had some people mention that to us, but you think of Newman's Own or Emeril's — there are tons and tons of personality-branded food products on the market. So we've taken that model and, using political satire, have highlighted his policies, his position changes."
I'm sure Glenn Reynolds and other conservative bloggers will immediately condemn this.
(cross posted on KnoxBlab)
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The Hypocrite Party
That figures. Besides the racist family values, what's also so hypocritical is that McCain's absolutely the biggest flip-flopper I can remember ever running for office, not counting Romney in the primary. Drilling, climate change, lobbying, Iraq, tax cuts for the rich, being a "maverick" against intolerance on the far right, etc.
Here's an interview with the
Here's an interview with the two, umm, people, who created this thing. Turns out they're Tennesseans. Great.
Outrage?
Well, here's a shocker for ya! Yeah....I'm a conservative, and I think it's pretty stupid! Just as stupid as all the other crap that's being spouted...on BOTH sides!
I'm a conservative, and I
I'm a conservative, and I think it's pretty stupid! Just as stupid as all the other crap that's being spouted...on BOTH sides!
I wouldn't care if it's stupid. I care because it's bigoted and racist.
Please, please, please point me to one example where the other side is spewing anything NEARLY this offensive.
Please, please, please point
Please, please, please point me to one example where the other side is spewing anything NEARLY this offensive.
Ok.
old man and the feces
I couldn't find any of the pictures they were talking about. Where's the one with the monkey pooping on McCain's head? I want to see a monkey pooping on his head! poidh
rikki: your monkey
(link...)
Offensive, yes. But not
Offensive, yes. But not bigoted and she doesn't have people lined up at a "Christian" conference paying $10 for it.
And while I found the pic with the shark's teeth, I can't find the monkey poo pic either. What would be the point of that exactly?
That the best you got, J. Ringo?
Not up to your usual snark standards.
I was having an off day.
I was having an off day.
You chose poorly...Part 47
The 101 Fighting Keyboardist for Obama need help.
(link...)
You're point being that the
You're point being that the racist crap is working? (Not sure why else you'd post that on this thread.)
So easy...so predicable
You're point being that the racist crap is working? (Not sure why else you'd post that on this thread.)
So you could embarrass yourself again?
Seriously, shouldn't you be in Ohio where you could do something other than be depressed?
Tennessee is so far in the Red that neither McCain nor Obama will visit this State. Why do you spend your time doing something that makes you unhappy?
I have absolutely no idea
I have absolutely no idea why you're using this thread to attack me.
Do you have anything to say about the subject of the thread or not?
Do you have anything to say
Do you have anything to say about the subject of the thread or not?
I did. Tennessee is not in play. What is the point of your outrage? Why not volunteer in Ohio for Obama if you care so much? Your team keep picking extremists yet you are confused why you lose.
What is the point of your
What is the point of your outrage?
The simple fact that you asked that question pretty much tells anybody all they need to know about you.
Watching that video literally made me feel sick.
Those two idiots represent the reason America is such a mess.
Check out this bigot's blog
Check out this bigot's blog profile:
We live in a parable culture. Friedrich Nietzsche once said, "Better songs would they have to sing, for me to believe in their Saviour." Our culture screams, "Tell me a better story and then I’ll believe in Jesus.”
I began communicating at Focus on the Family and then engineered/produced the daily radio program “FamilyLife Today” for five years. I became the acquisitions editor for FamilyLife Publishing in 98. I wrote or worked on resources including Passport to Purity, Jonah: A Very Veggie Family Adventure, and the amazon.com best-seller Simply Romantic® Nights. In Mar 04, I joined Nelson Ministry Services as a consultant. In Dec 05, I became the Sr. Acquisitions Editor for Gen Reference Books in Nelson's Bible Group. In Mar 07, I went out on my own as a writer and editor. My wife and I live with our four children in Franklin, TN.
Yup, I'm sure Jesus would think they're telling a real good story.
I'm sure they are all
I'm sure they are all chuckling like little Bush Frat boys and Sorority girls. This national organization should be ashamed. Why is it the originators of this design sought sanctuary in Nashville, Tennessee? Because the conservative "values" voters in Nashville have proven they have no morals.
Senators Alexander and Corker should once again stand up and exclaim their disapproval of such activities.
Without shame
THAT is the problem with this party. Their only response is "they do it too" even when "they" don't.
I just see...
...a yellow box with a black guy in a white shirt smiling at some waffles.
This caption at Yahoo! agrees with your outrage, Rachel:
"A vendor at a conservative political forum was selling boxes of waffle mix depicting Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama as a racial stereotype on its front..."
"As a racial stereotype?" I don't get it. What does that even mean?
Black people depicted on product packaging are racial stereotypes? Black people who appear to like waffles are racial stereotypes? Any association with packaged pancake/waffle mixes and/or syrups is an inherent racist attack? Black people who are being mocked in any way are the victims of racial stereotyping? Or what?
With all due respect, I think the outrage here is a bit overdone. It seems weirdly, perhaps vicariously hypersensitive and at worst paranoid. People who mock Obama as a waffler are not de facto racists anymore than people who think McCain is a tad unhinged are automatic haters of the aged or anymore than people who caricature the President as an imbecile chimpanzee are universal loathers of people with special needs.
Surely, Pre (not verified) dear, you're just putting us on?
When I first read your posts I thought you were serious, but of course that's ridiculous. No one with a functioning brain and an 8th grade education could possibly think outrage over this is "a bit overdone". The only two places this pancake product would go over as a big fat funny joke would be at a a Republican "family values" convention or a Klan meeting.
I've noticed there are some people on these blogs who feign shock at anything Liberals think. It's a kind of sport for them. I count you among these people, and I totally agree with Rachel, if you're as unevolved as you appear, then it's easy to see why you can't understand what the fuss is about. If you're just pulling our leg, then that deserves a very small chuckle and a pass. In a world full of people trying to solve problems and restore our nation's TRUE values---the ones our constitution guarantees, then may I suggest with all due respect, your mind appears infant-dismally small (and that's not a mispelling).
Just a hunch...
But I don't think many progressives would want to live in the libertarian (liberal as it was called then) world the Framers of the Constitution envisioned when they wrote that document. There was no notion of a social safety net. There was no notion of government regulation of private enterprise. All taxation had to be proportionate (the income tax required an Amendment to become legal) They really only wanted a workable central government just strong enough (only just) to adequately protect the union of - then - soveriegn states from external threats or internal collapse by incessant bickering over commerce between the - then - soveriegn states. I'm libertarian enough to call myself a libertarian, and I don't think I could be content living in such a laissez-faire world as the Framers intended when they wrote the Constitution.
The principle architect of the Constitution was James Madison. If you invested some time in researching what he believed and how he thought about the world around him, I think you would find many, many areas of ideological disagreement.
The Constitution contains more than the original document
Agreed. Unlike Barack Obama I am not a serious student of Constitutional law, but I do know enough to realize the Framers wrote an amazing document for the times. Their perception however was naturally limited by the age in which they lived.
When I refered to traditional American values, I was not refering to a strict literal interpretation of the original Consititution written by the Framers. That would in my opinion, like strict interpretation of the Bible, just lead to endless arguments about "orginal" meanings and intent of men long ago gone.
I do know eneough about the Constitution to believe in its basic tenets and in our Bill of Rights and other historic documents that reflect a desire for America to be a nation that has high ideals and attempts to realize equality for all.
Whether or not we achieve these, I believe it is a noble goal to strive toward.
Now I understand...
But you would probably be more comfortable looking to an earlier American document for your inspiration. I think the Declaration of Independence would be much more appropriate to what you're trying to say than the Constitution, especially since the latter affixed the value of a human being of African descent as 3/5th's of a person. That's hardly an embodiment of "equality for all."
So you're saying...
The Framer's failed to anticipate the industrial revolution, living as they were just on its cusp? Wow, there's a hugely surprising revelation. If these men had the alleged powers of Nostradamus, what would they have done differently, bearing in mind they were men of the Enlightment fully grounded in a Lockean philosophy?
And good sir, "Economics is bullshit" and Adam Smith's Invisible Hand is nothing more than social interactions? I dare say I'm being called a bullshit artist by a professional of the art.
But then, perhaps your Ivor Cutler quote is not intended for ironic effect.
Let's go back to reading comprehension...
What I said was...
Or maybe I should have just put /Sarcasm blocks around that? I thought it would be clear to you what I meant. But just in case you aren't clear, I was saying that it was hardly a surprise the Framers didn't anticipate the Industrial Revolution. I then asked you what they would have done different had they anticipated the industrial revolution? Would that knowledge have made them any less men of their own time or any less influenced by the philosophies that led them to revolt from Great Britain? I don't think it would. I think the Constitution would still look pretty much the same is it does now. I was just offering you an opportunity to state differently.
And it's not incumbent upon me to validate the existence of a market. I'm not the voice crying in the wilderness running around declaring an entire field of study to be a "horseshit positivist discipline." I do believe it's customary for the voice radically out of step with the orthodoxy to prove his case, not vice-versa. Besides, not being an economist myself, it would both unwelcome and hubristic for me to intervene on their behalf - given they are far better qualified to defend themselves than I.
I merely maintain that for you to declare an entire field of study to be total bullshit, offer no proof of that statement, and then attempt to validate the same by daring other people to prove you wrong is the work of a master bullshit artist.
Re. there was no notion of
Re. there was no notion of etc. etc. by the Framers of the Constitution:
Preamble (presumably written and/or approved by the Framers):
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare...
Then you mean...
that the Framers wrote the preamble and used terms like "domestric Tranquilty" and "general Welfare" to mean they intended for there to be something resembling a social safety net? Not only did they intend that, they were of such one accord on its necessity, that the only protracted debate over its wording revolved around whether to say "We the People" or "We the States"? One Founding Father not attending the convention, Patick Henry, later vehemently fought against its ratification based on that singular turn of phrase.
I do believe the Preamble was written to explain why they had met to develop a new document, to establish a new government, replacing what had existed under the Articles of Confederation. Indeed, since they had been sent ostensibly to suggest reforms of the Articles of Confederation, they needed to explain why they had, instead, decided to recommend their replacement altogehter. The Preamble following "We the People of the United States" is very nearly a laundry list of the shortcomings of the earlier document:
- The national government could not have its own court system
- The national government could not levy or collect taxes
- The national government could not raise an army
- The national government could not regulate trade
- Each state printed its own currency
- States placed tariffs on one another's goods
I've not read in any writings of any of the founders that they held a belief that the government had a responsibility to provide for those who could not provide for themselves. I'm not an expert on the history of the Progressive movement, but I am not aware of the existence of even a workhouse in the United States until just before the war of 1812. A private, charitable organization in Philadelphia established one sometime around then in the form of a textile mill. I think they called themselves "Guardians of the Poor" or "Protectors of the Poor" or something very similar. I do know the Progressive movement in the United States has its roots in acts of aid and charity by private organizations of philanthropic individuals and was fairly slow - compared to Great Britain - to begin to make use of the power of government to aid in their goals.
"As a racial stereotype?" I
"As a racial stereotype?" I don't get it. What does that even mean?
Anybody who asks that is either disengenuous or a bigot themselves.
Obama as Aunt Jemima on the front, as a Muslim in headress on the top, and as a Mexican in a sombrero on the back.
It's three, three, three racial sterotypes in one!
Well, be careful on that last one...
not to detract from your completely valid point in the original post, but as part of a company that has very, very recently done a lot of research into how to expand our products' appeal to Hispanic consumers, the "Mexican in a sombrero" brought back a very surprising result. Our marketing team didn't even consider such a stereotypical suggestion, but 19 out of 19 focus groups in South Texas, Arizona, and California all came back with unsolicited suggestions that our Hispanic pitch man should "wear a sombrero or something," to make it clear he's Mexican. Weirder things have happened, but not many.
Ultimately, what we learned is that Hispanics are not defined by their language (many Hispanics actually speak one of several native American dialects as a first language), a singular culture (a Mexican is not a Guatemalan is not a Salvadoran), and certainly not a race. Much like Southerners are defined by their "Southernness," Hispanics are defined by unique cultural symbols, icons, and yes, stereotypes. Fascinating stuff. You have to be careful with how you use a stereotype (and putting Obama in one does NOT work any more than putting him a John Deere hat would work), but you cannot fail to acknowledge them and still get your message across to that demographic.
I don't think I'm disengenuous...
...so I guess that makes me a straightup h8r.
Sheesh.
I'd totally buy your explanation if the box depicted Obama in a do-rag. But Islam is not a race, and the guy's clearly not Mexican. Is someone accusing him of being Latino? I can think of worse things to call someone.
So again, what does this whole "as a racial stereotype" even mean?
If it's so obvious, why won't you make it clear?
I stand by my previous
I stand by my previous statement - disengenuous or bigoted. Although I'll allow for "raised in a cave and knows nothing about American history or political culture."
Hmm. So I'm either...
...disingenuous, a racist, or utterly ignorant.
Nice. You can't explain your whole "racial stereotype" trope, so you resort to the tried and true ad hominem.
Rachel, you demonstrate very well how eaten-up with self-justifying hatred are some on the left. Pot, meet Kettle.
And again I say, "Sheesh."
You can't explain your whole
self-justifying hatred
I wouldn't say I hate the guys who produced this thing, or those of you who defend it. More like despise.
You can't explain your whole "racial stereotype" trope
Why waste my time trying to explain the self-evident to someone who refuses to see it?
But if you want to do a bit of research, go out on the street and ask the first black person you see if s/he thinks portraying someone as Aunt Jemima is a racial stereotype.
You know, here's something I truly don't get: why a Republican would want to defend such racist crap.
All you have to do is say "yup, these guys were over the line." It's not that hard. Just because they're on your team doesn't mean you have to agree with/defend every single thing they do.
For the record, I thought the photographer referenced above was over the line (although she was just mean rather than bigoted).
See. It's not hard.
I'm not defending racist crap.
I'm just trying to understand why you're so indignant about this particular example of lame political caricature. And why you and other people here seem to prefer personal attack to actual discussion about it.
It would not occur to me to not vote for someone because he or she is black or Latino or Asian or anything else. I would, however, not want to vote for someone whose positions on important issues seem to waffle with the wind. (Unfortunately, and peripherally, I'm not left with good choices in this election.) Race isn't a factor for me. Why would it be for anyone?
If Obama were bent in a more libertarian direction, I would vote for him in half a shake, in fact. I prefer post-racial politics to identity politics. That's how I think, and it's what I believe in. The sooner we move past that crap, the better for everyone.
That's why the extreme racism-based offensiveness of the yellow waffle mix box is no more self-evident to me than is its cleverness. It wouldn't have occurred to me to see it as a racist thing at all if people hadn't started using it to accuse other people of race-based hatred.
Now, all of you please resume your clever, clever statements of abhorrence.
Get your foot off the neck of the black man cracker...
You know, here's something I truly don't get: why a Republican would want to defend such racist crap.
Here are some liberal cartoonists you need to damn to hell:
(link...)
Here are a few about the right Rev. Jackson, the other one:
(link...)
Don't you just hate racists?
Your brain is not working
Please show me how any of those cartoons matches up to the waffle box in shear racism.
-Sugarfatpie (AKA Alex Pulsipher)
"X-Rays are a hoax."-Lord Kelvin
Racism patrol...
Please show me how any of those cartoons matches up to the waffle box in shear racism.
Is this sheer racism? Another black man another breakfast food.
(link...)
I figured you'd go for Uncle
I figured you'd go for Uncle Ben or Aunt Jemima.
____________________________
the distance between black & white is much further than i would like until now i never noticed that fascism has many disguises -d. boon, 1981
Please show me how any of
Niner, surely you jest. It's almost stunning that you would attempt to compare a photo of Michael Jordan and a cartoon stereotype like this:
(link...)
Why do you insist on defending this kind of stuff?
Even Lou Dobbs is embarrassed to be connected to this:
(link...)
Especially Michael Jordan on
Especially Michael Jordan on a Wheaties box. That, apparently, is a special honor.
Perhaps...
Niner, surely you jest.
Are you accusing me of using rhetorical devices? I thought only Randy, Metulj, and rikki were cleared for that. Do I need a license or some special KnoxViews clearance?
Are you accusing me of
Rhetorical devices are fine, if they work. So if you are making the point that Michael Jordan = Stepinfetchit/Uncle Ben, I guess you succeeded. I guess.
Why do you insist on
Why do you insist on defending this kind of stuff?
My experience is when people look for racism they find it whether it exist or not.
A commenter at Buzzflash said it pretty well, "Oh God spare us all the self righteousness of the deep and meaningful. All the people complaining about the "racist" waffles are no different than the neocons who complain about lipstick and pigs. Are you seriously suggesting that a caricature of Obama or any minority politician is out of line? I hate the neocons and have no love for Republicans but I'm equally disgusted by the self-righteous lefties who insist that those who disagree with them are racists and should be kick off the air."
(link...)
So you ARE arguing with the
So you ARE arguing with the Reverend Jackson? When he said the Obama waffles were racist, an insult to all black people, and that he and his staff were offended, he was what? Whining? Overreacting?
Seriously, I'd like to know what you would say to the Reverend.
Seriously...again...
Seriously, I'd like to know what you would say to the Reverend.
Rachel, Bean, gay Butterfly, anyone else, wouldn't be great to live in a place where anyone could be satirized on a box of waffles without regard to the amount of pigment they have in their skin? I hope someday to live in a place like that. You have no idea what colorblind mean do you?
Again, a commenter at Buzzflash said it pretty well, "Oh God spare us all the self righteousness of the deep and meaningful. All the people complaining about the "racist" waffles are no different than the neocons who complain about lipstick and pigs. Are you seriously suggesting that a caricature of Obama or any minority politician is out of line? I hate the neocons and have no love for Republicans but I'm equally disgusted by the self-righteous lefties who insist that those who disagree with them are racists and should be kick off the air."
Seriously, grow up.
A commenter at Buzzflash
Nobody's saying that all caricatures of Obama are racist. I'm saying THIS caricature of Obama is racist, and that people who try to claim otherwise are either hopelessly stupid, racist or obtuse.
Toby,
Or all of the above. See my little lover boy: # 9.
I don't like you that way. You a tech kind of guy, don't put the input in the output. It wasn't designed for that. Know what I mean?
My best to your family. Perhaps your Church could suggest some consoling?
Do what you have to do...
Seriously. I am so ashamed of the way I feel for you.
Considering how you have been pursued by Internet stalkers I am surprised at how you would do this. Do you have a book on how to be an Internet bully? I know you can't take me in a debate, so this is how you respond? Like a little kid?
I cannot believe I treated you decently when you were being assaulted.
It couldn't be you could it Toby? Because that would be so hypocritical...and yet you have the tagline, "True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler"
These are the tags at KnoxBlab:
#9 has a very sore anus, #9 is a power bottom,
#9 has bush orgasms, #9 has no idea who he is, #9 loves teabagging, infinite goodbye, metulj makes #9 wet,
#9 has crabs, #9 is a power bottom, #9 loves to get cornholed,
#9 has crabs, #9 has smegma issues,
#9 is a power bottom, #9 loves to get cornholed (posted twice, oh goody)
So tell us Toby, that isn't you is it?
Y'all knock that shit off or
Y'all knock that shit off or take it outside.
A little test
Let's see which category you fit in, OK?
Just one little test will do.
Only two words that have already been mentioned.
Please explain the meaning and elaborate on the usage in politics:
dog whistle
You may now begin.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
Hunter S. Thompson
Really...
Anybody who asks that is either disingenuous or a bigot themselves.
Get to work, more racial stereotyping. When will it end?
(link...)
It's a three-fer. Your basic
It's a three-fer.
Your basic bigot now hates Hispanics and/or Muslims more than he hates blacks, so why not tar this biracial man with every stereotype you can dredge up? The caricature of Michelle Obama as a bug-eyed nutcase is lovely, too. And so much safer than calling them names that would get you in trouble if you did it publicly.
Pretty fitting from people who worship a woman who quoted Westbrook Pegler in her acceptance speech.
What's in a name?
Hmmm, wonder what (not verified) "pre" stands for?
prejudiced?
prepubescent?
premature ejaculator?
or just
predictable.
pre-Cambrian ________________
pre-Cambrian
____________________________
the distance between black & white is much further than i would like until now i never noticed that fascism has many disguises -d. boon, 1981
For pre and Mike: Harry R.
For pre and Mike:
Harry R. Jackson, black conservative pastor and a member of the Family Research Council, wrote on the conservative Town Hall about the Obama waffles incident.
The only negative thing that came out of the Values Voter's Summit was that two men from Franklin Tennessee (Mark Whitlock and Bob DeMoss) sold a product called "Obama Waffles" at the event until the conference leaders shut them down on Saturday.
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the so-called political "satire" on the boxes of waffles is racist and makes fun of all African Americans - not to mention unfairly demeaning Barak Obama.
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When African-American members of my conference staff and volunteers saw the product, it deeply offended them.
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Conservatives should repudiate people that want to use racism as a weapon in this election.
So how 'bout it, guys - care to argue with the Rev. Jackson?
"...care to argue with the Rev. Jackson?"
Not me. Obviously I was wrong.
Umm, Mike, waiting for you
Umm, Mike, waiting for you to argue with the Reverend here?
Hey, Thanks a million, Nine
Hey, Thanks a million, Nine -- this guy's good!
(link...)
Why do you insist on
Could it have something to do with this cartoon?
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