There are currently 2 users and 248 guests online.
We need a public meeting sponsored by the City/County to address the root causes of the shooting
Submitted by sugarfatpie on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 8:46am.
We need to address the following:
community mental health needs
how to replace hate-media with more inclusive forums/discussions
joblessness
gun violence
probably a whole lot of other things I've overlooked (please suggest more)
We need a public forum, sponsored by local government, where people can express themselves, not just listen to speeches.
We need action, from concerned citizens as well as local govt that addresses our vulnerability to this sort of crime so that people who want to move/stay/return here can do so without feeling afraid.
I personally would like to see a drive to support more understanding and inclusive programming on local AM stations.
A proper, independent listener supported radio station is the only way to go. You will never get WNOX to come off the Car Dealership ad teat. I offer WFMU as an example of a station that allows a wide range of viewpoints (from LGBT shows to a drive time morning show hosted by an hardline pro-Israel Orthodox Jew).
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Submitted by reform4 on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 10:46am.
I certainly agree with the idea of more leadership on the issues of community mental health needs and ensuring that people as troubled as Mr. Adkisson get the help they need before bad things happen.
Resolving the issue of hate media and guns locally? Good luck. Even if you got WNOX to drop Limbaugh/Hannity/Savage (and I don't necessarily advocate that), they still have a national following. Those issues would need to be addressed by national level leaders. If WNOX and other stations wanted to provide some more balance in their programming, that would be a nice offer, but it's not a role for the local government to demand it (if the Feds want to bring back the Fairness Doctrine, that's another issue...).
I would continue to opine that Mr. Adkisson had his demons, and just latched onto certain things to feel empowered and to feel that his life would have some meaning, no matter how misguided an approach he took. Evil does not exist by itself- IMHO, we can and should focus on the root causes- substance abuse (alcohol in this case), joblessness, poverty, and a general lack of community and support by isolated individuals. And it's a more realistic goal for Knoxville to take on, and addresses more less visible outcomes (domestic abuse, child abuse, etc).
[consider, for example, the response of Columbine, and their move to improve outreach to disaffected students in their schools]
Submitted by Bird_dog on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 4:21pm.
Having an adult loved one "with issues," we have been extremely frustrated trying to access the mental health system on his behalf. Privacy, individual rights, deinstitutionalization, tenncare, you-name-it...
The person with mental illness often does not recognize or acknowledge their own symptoms. And without treatment, the outlook is grim. I never heard any more about Kristen's (?) Law, giving courts the right to order outpatient treatment, that Tim Burchett sponsored in the TN Legislature this session - guess it died in committee. There was concern about costs, but, the price will be paid either in tragedy, or jail, or homeless services, or just plain wasted lives...
Community forums are a good thing, but I think they are just "preaching to the choir". A person who is not in their right mind, can always find a target for their delusions and paranoia: food additives, cell phones, the internet - and plenty of so-called "evidence" to justify those fears...
Submitted by Carole Borges on Wed, 2008/07/30 - 8:05am.
For all the money we spend on mental "health" so little of the help offered actually has a direct effect on those afflicted. It's a very complex problem and many earnest people are applying themselves diligently to the effort of trying to help those with mental problems, but it seems to me the whole system needs to be re-vamped.
It was a positive move when people were de-institutionalized, but there was supposed to be case management to help individuals maintain an ability to be in society without hurting themselves or others. Unfortunately this has been sorely lacking for some very legitimate reasons. It's hard to keep people involved in programs they don't want to be enrolled in, and it's very difficult for people with a serious mental illnesses to realize they need medication that helps "normalize" them because often the side effects are troubling. Too often they are just given pills and no other kind of therapy, and of course money.
A person I know who really needs to see a therapist, who is eager to see a therapist about her very serious problems told me the other day that "there is no such thing a talk therapy anymore". This may not be true, but it was obvious she hadn't been able to find anyone in Knoxville she could create a theraputic caring relationship with.
No one can say that talk therapy might have helped the shooter. He might never have accessed that kind of help, but if he had, he might have found someone to care about his loss of work, to help put some kind of perspective on his misplaced hatred and rage toward towards groups of innocent people.
The root of this problem and the prevention of this kind of rage can't happen until people do more than simply shake their heads, brand people as whackos, and then abandon them to the nightmare their illness causes.
Things need to change, but I don't think they will change. Too many people in the mental health field think mental illness is an incurable disease. Since the advent of designer drugs, maintainance with pharmacueticals has become the end goal. Few other types of therapy are offered. Some mentally ill people are afraid to admit they have problems. No one talks about a cure anymore. Too many people believe that mentally ill people are hopeless, that all we can do is avoid them, and pray they won't hurt us.
This obviously doesn't work.
If it did maybe this would not be week of mourning in Knoxville.
First off, my condolences goes out to the families of the deceased. I pray that the injured, not only the physically injured, but all who suffered physically and mentally from this heinous crime will have a successful recovery. I know this is something one never heals fully from, but time can ease some pain. It was specially tragic that children had to witness this crime but they were also witnesses to acts of bravery by their congregation. Maybe, by witnessing how these brave individuals took control of this serious situation will help dampen their fears of crimes such as this and make them stronger in the future.
Now to the matter of the crime and how the media may be a contributing factor.
Rush and other talk show hosts like him, create a boiling pot of hatred. Not only of Conservatives but also of Liberals. They seem to live just to create pressure between the two groups. Mr. A@#*$$*n may or may not listen to Rush or other conservative talk shows. This is something that I am curious to know, but whether he did or did not, I can almost guarantee that his hatred was a bi-product of it. Something else probably played a role in this crime, it is how the national media sensationalizes all these school shootings. Mr. A@#*$$*n probably felt that this was a way to get free national coverage for his cause while also escaping his own personal torment. But fate had it that for the most part his plans were dashed away by the members of the church.
Submitted by Tamara Shepherd on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 8:35pm.
Not to change the subject, but I just want to thank Elrod and likely others here for the posts you've made at the N-S site over these last couple of days. The conversation there desperately needed your input, especially today, and I was relieved to see you arrive.
Strangely, my own response to this incident has been to feel extremely weak and fatigued. I've read every word of the news coverage, and as many of the comment boards as I could stomach, but I just haven't been able to string together a coherent sentence to join the conversation--or even to express my sympathy to some friends and acquaintances I know were present when this happened.
Instead, I've slept too much, and seen my dreams permeated by reenactments of the shooting.
I don't know what's wrong with me recently, but I truly appreciate Elrod and others for being my voice right now.
Submitted by sugarfatpie on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 10:28pm.
you might not get what your community really needs.
The communities touched by these could probably come up some solutions that people in DC or Boston wouldn't think of. The older I get, the less faith I have in national level politics and the more I see the importance and potential of local solutions to national/global problems. Even if you do have national or even global political resolve to take on an issue, these problems often take on geographically specific qualities that make local input on their resolution essential. So at any stage in the awakening process, local action is important. I agree that coordination at larger scales is a good idea, but inaction for fear of pissing in the wind, is well...unwarranted.
Also, if you read my message carefully, you will see that I am not asking local government to "demand" anything. I would like to see people come together in a public forum and share perspectives on what the problems are, and what the solutions may be. Wether the solutions involve government action or not is up to the thousands of people touched by this event to decide.
Submitted by reform4 on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 11:08pm.
I've just been reading too much of the divisive comments on the KNS site, and it can make you lose hope. Instead, I need to remember the 100s of people that came out Monday night.
Thanks for dragging me back, I think I'm just going to stop reading the KNS comments altogether.
Submitted by sugarfatpie on Wed, 2008/07/30 - 7:52am.
Its worth trying to bring folks around over there though. Get them off their high horses. People can really work themselves into a frenzy.
I went over there for a while and didn't even know where to begin. I finally ended up sending a note to the author of the KNS coverage to not leap to too many conclusions about Adkisson's motivations, which I think the articles do. I also found the wording of the 1st paragraph in yesterday's sentinel atrocious. Goes way to far towards promoting the shooter's views.
The shooting has laid bare some profoundly unmet needs in our community. I don't think we will know what those are until we have some face to face, community wide discussions of what our problems are.
PS I thought what you said to the news media on sunday regarding our need to take better care of the mentally ill was right on. Just the right thing to say at that time.
Submitted by reform4 on Wed, 2008/07/30 - 10:44am.
When we were searching for the three missing kids, I saw some worried people at the fence (she had a sister inside). When I went to help her, some media person said they heard an exagerrated figure of deaths/injuries, and I just snapped back that it wasn't right. The next thing I knew...
I just hope I did more good than harm that morning. We can see how damaging leaving the rumor mill can be.
I had wondered from the first moment about political motivation, but kept praying I was wrong. Even so, he had a lot of demons he was wrestling with. Maybe if self help books sold better than wingnut hit books....
Submitted by Rigsby Werner (not verified) on Tue, 2008/07/29 - 10:50am.
far behind.
When people have no realistic job future in Knoxville and no way to escape to better opportunities, the social fabric deteriorates and the traditional rules of society get thrown out the door. This guy wasn't hungry, he was flat out pissed and had way too much time to think about it, plan on what he was going to do, and execute his plan. Had he had something industrius to do with his life (beyond working in a $10 a hour call center/no benefits or working in our wonder retail segments at Turkey Creek) perhaps he would have been more concerned about his own well being and not lashing out at others.
Local leadership needs to get off their fat arses and get out there and develop a local economy which is not based on government, not for profits, call centers or retail strip centers built by their developer buddies and financed by the taxpayers through TIFS. Come on Knoxville, get in the game.
Submitted by kelaad (not verified) on Thu, 2008/07/31 - 8:54am.
“Most laws governing the treatment of mentally ill individuals assume that such individuals are competent to accept or reject treatment, with the sole exception of obvious dementia. Yet, contemporary research has established that up to half of all individuals with severe psychiatric disorders are not competent to assess their own need for treatment. The consequences of this misunderstanding have led to increasing numbers of mentally ill individuals who are homeless, incarcerated, and victimized, and increasing numbers of individuals who commit homicides and other violent acts. This misunderstanding underlies one of the great social disaster of late twentieth-century America.” Dr. Fuller Torrey in his book The Insanity Offense. "The sad truth that in many part of the country there is no mental health system,” says Michael J. Fitzpatrick, executive director of NAMI. In each of the preventable tragedies told in the book, there is a solution. “Dr. Torrey’s unflinching analysis shows that caring for severely mentally ill people is not impossible,” notes author Sally Satel, M.D. “It should be required reading on Capitol Hill and in state houses across the country.”
Kendra's Law requring mandatory outpatient treatment has been enacted and proven effective in New York. This law helps lessen preventable tragedies from occuring. Not only should mental health help be assessible to those who need it, it must be accepted by them. Kendra's Law assures court-ordered mandatory outpatient treatment for the untreated mentally ill individual at risk to themselves or others. Please support efforts for a Kendra's Law in Tennessee. Urge our legislators to reconsider senate bill 1269 in it's original form. For more information on Kendra's Law, go to the Treatment Advocacy Center's website at Link...
Kendra's Law requring mandatory outpatient treatment has been enacted and proven effective in New York. This law helps lessen preventable tragedies from occuring. Not only should mental health help be assessible to those who need it, it must be accepted by them. Kendra's Law assures court-ordered mandatory outpatient treatment for the untreated mentally ill individual at risk to themselves or others.
Are you talking lobotomies, drugs, therapy? The case of the shooter @ Virgina Tech wasn't he on some type of treatment or at least supposed to be? Hasn't it been proven that when someone has been on treatment for a prolonged time, that if they should somehow miss their treatments they become worse than what they were before they began their treatments?
"Kendra's Law requring mandatory outpatient treatment for the untreated mentally ill individual at risk to themselves"
We are all at risk to ourselves. Anyone who writes on a blog could be considered a risk to themselves or others. All of us seem to have an uncontrollable urge to blurt out(excluding this post)our opinions without knowing what consequences our posts may have on us and others. This law walks a fine line between thinking that you are helping someone's mental well being, and trampling on ones personal rights.
I could almost see it being mandatory if someone committed a serious crime and were incarcerated, but for a doctor to diagnose someone and then force them against their will to be treated. Well, there's just something in that law that seems immoral to me.
"proven effective in New York" (4 out of five doctors recommended!)
Effective to whom? The individual? The doctors who receive kick-backs for prescribing these drugs? or to the people who have to interact with these individuals? Is it only used to make other peoples lives easier?
When we get to the point of forcing someone to ingest a substance into their bodies against their will, it means we no longer have control of the only remaining sanctuary we have from this world. Our bodies! This not only affects the "mentally ill", this affects you, me, or anyone else. "All" freedom, let me repeat myself, "all" freedom is lost. To me, the fact that you think that this is okay makes you a possible danger to society. Maybe you should be considered for the treatment.
Submitted by sugarfatpie on Thu, 2008/08/07 - 2:43pm.
And like it or not, our bodies are regulated. We regulate how fast we can hurtle our bodies down the road, what we can do with the waste's our bodies create, and absolutely what we can do to others with our bodies.
I don't like the notion of someone being forced to take their meds, but I really don't like the idea of potential killers being off their meds and on the streets.
But this is only a part of the problem. As a previous post pointed out, mental health care has become a drug dispensing system. This is a symptom of resources being misdirected by our current health care system. We need much more preventive care and outreach to mentally unstable people. If we had that, Adkison might not have chosen the path he did. He might have received the help he needed.
I'd like to know more about how mental health is dealt with in Canada, and the EU. Anyone know anything about this?
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Fri, 2008/08/01 - 6:34am.
"We are all at risk to ourselves. Anyone who writes on a blog could be considered a risk to themselves or others. All of us seem to have an uncontrollable urge to blurt out(excluding this post)our opinions without knowing what consequences our posts may have on us and others. This law walks a fine line between thinking that you are helping someone's mental well being, and trampling on ones personal rights."
Haven't we had enough trampling on personal rights by untreated mental illness in our town ... just this year? David Rudd, Micah Johnson and now David Adkisson? To know that this trampling could have possibly been prevented by mandatory outpatient mental health treatment is a tragedy indeed. All I'm saying is Kendra's law makes good sense. 43 other states have it. Why doesn't Tennessee?
If anyone is interested in helping lobby the state legislature to enact Kendra's Law, please e-mail me at 'steve@reform4.com'.
Although we don't know if this would have prevented this particular tragedy (and from the legal definition, Adkisson is clearly legally 'sane'.. he knew the police would be coming, therefore he knew what he was doing was illegal), the issue of untreated mental illness still seems like a potential risk factor for future events.
Submitted by kelaad (not verified) on Fri, 2008/08/01 - 1:19pm.
Exerpt from Treatment Advocacy Center Briefing paper re: the effectiveness of Kendra's law in NY - especially note the last sentence.
Yes, there IS a potential risk posed by not responding to individuals in need and unfortunately Knoxvillians are now more than familiar with that risk.
"Kendra’s Law improves the system’s ability to help those in need
Not only is Kendra’s Law helping the individuals in the program, it is also helping the system better provide treatment to all those in need. The New York Office of Mental Health detailed some of these systemic benefits in its final report: "Counties and stakeholder groups statewide have reported that the implementation of processes to provide AOT to individuals under court orders has resulted in beneficial structural changes to local mental health service delivery systems… The implementation of AOT has also supported the development of more collaborative relationships between the mental health and court systems. AOT has been instrumental in increasing accountability at all system levels regarding delivery of services to high need individuals.”
The increased accountability led to a shift in the manner in which treatment to high need individuals was viewed: “Local mental health systems began to identify the potential risk posed by not responding to individuals in need, and as a result, those systems improved their ability to respond more efficiently and effectively.”"
Submitted by StaceyDiamond on Thu, 2008/07/31 - 3:25pm.
See Knoxville Googled in the front of today's Metro Pulse, the piece from Huffington Post talks about how the right wing policies drives people like Adkisson to the breaking point and them tell him its all the liberal's fault, the piece says it well. Many, many people are at that breaking point, but they don't kill anyone beacuse they aren't mentally ill or sociopathic.
Michael Silence:
Link...
A proper, independent listener supported radio station is the only way to go. You will never get WNOX to come off the Car Dealership ad teat. I offer WFMU as an example of a station that allows a wide range of viewpoints (from LGBT shows to a drive time morning show hosted by an hardline pro-Israel Orthodox Jew).
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
I certainly agree with the idea of more leadership on the issues of community mental health needs and ensuring that people as troubled as Mr. Adkisson get the help they need before bad things happen.
Resolving the issue of hate media and guns locally? Good luck. Even if you got WNOX to drop Limbaugh/Hannity/Savage (and I don't necessarily advocate that), they still have a national following. Those issues would need to be addressed by national level leaders. If WNOX and other stations wanted to provide some more balance in their programming, that would be a nice offer, but it's not a role for the local government to demand it (if the Feds want to bring back the Fairness Doctrine, that's another issue...).
I would continue to opine that Mr. Adkisson had his demons, and just latched onto certain things to feel empowered and to feel that his life would have some meaning, no matter how misguided an approach he took. Evil does not exist by itself- IMHO, we can and should focus on the root causes- substance abuse (alcohol in this case), joblessness, poverty, and a general lack of community and support by isolated individuals. And it's a more realistic goal for Knoxville to take on, and addresses more less visible outcomes (domestic abuse, child abuse, etc).
[consider, for example, the response of Columbine, and their move to improve outreach to disaffected students in their schools]
Having an adult loved one "with issues," we have been extremely frustrated trying to access the mental health system on his behalf. Privacy, individual rights, deinstitutionalization, tenncare, you-name-it...
The person with mental illness often does not recognize or acknowledge their own symptoms. And without treatment, the outlook is grim. I never heard any more about Kristen's (?) Law, giving courts the right to order outpatient treatment, that Tim Burchett sponsored in the TN Legislature this session - guess it died in committee. There was concern about costs, but, the price will be paid either in tragedy, or jail, or homeless services, or just plain wasted lives...
Community forums are a good thing, but I think they are just "preaching to the choir". A person who is not in their right mind, can always find a target for their delusions and paranoia: food additives, cell phones, the internet - and plenty of so-called "evidence" to justify those fears...
For all the money we spend on mental "health" so little of the help offered actually has a direct effect on those afflicted. It's a very complex problem and many earnest people are applying themselves diligently to the effort of trying to help those with mental problems, but it seems to me the whole system needs to be re-vamped.
It was a positive move when people were de-institutionalized, but there was supposed to be case management to help individuals maintain an ability to be in society without hurting themselves or others. Unfortunately this has been sorely lacking for some very legitimate reasons. It's hard to keep people involved in programs they don't want to be enrolled in, and it's very difficult for people with a serious mental illnesses to realize they need medication that helps "normalize" them because often the side effects are troubling. Too often they are just given pills and no other kind of therapy, and of course money.
A person I know who really needs to see a therapist, who is eager to see a therapist about her very serious problems told me the other day that "there is no such thing a talk therapy anymore". This may not be true, but it was obvious she hadn't been able to find anyone in Knoxville she could create a theraputic caring relationship with.
No one can say that talk therapy might have helped the shooter. He might never have accessed that kind of help, but if he had, he might have found someone to care about his loss of work, to help put some kind of perspective on his misplaced hatred and rage toward towards groups of innocent people.
The root of this problem and the prevention of this kind of rage can't happen until people do more than simply shake their heads, brand people as whackos, and then abandon them to the nightmare their illness causes.
Things need to change, but I don't think they will change. Too many people in the mental health field think mental illness is an incurable disease. Since the advent of designer drugs, maintainance with pharmacueticals has become the end goal. Few other types of therapy are offered. Some mentally ill people are afraid to admit they have problems. No one talks about a cure anymore. Too many people believe that mentally ill people are hopeless, that all we can do is avoid them, and pray they won't hurt us.
This obviously doesn't work.
If it did maybe this would not be week of mourning in Knoxville.
First off, my condolences goes out to the families of the deceased. I pray that the injured, not only the physically injured, but all who suffered physically and mentally from this heinous crime will have a successful recovery. I know this is something one never heals fully from, but time can ease some pain. It was specially tragic that children had to witness this crime but they were also witnesses to acts of bravery by their congregation. Maybe, by witnessing how these brave individuals took control of this serious situation will help dampen their fears of crimes such as this and make them stronger in the future.
Now to the matter of the crime and how the media may be a contributing factor.
Rush and other talk show hosts like him, create a boiling pot of hatred. Not only of Conservatives but also of Liberals. They seem to live just to create pressure between the two groups. Mr. A@#*$$*n may or may not listen to Rush or other conservative talk shows. This is something that I am curious to know, but whether he did or did not, I can almost guarantee that his hatred was a bi-product of it. Something else probably played a role in this crime, it is how the national media sensationalizes all these school shootings. Mr. A@#*$$*n probably felt that this was a way to get free national coverage for his cause while also escaping his own personal torment. But fate had it that for the most part his plans were dashed away by the members of the church.
Not to change the subject, but I just want to thank Elrod and likely others here for the posts you've made at the N-S site over these last couple of days. The conversation there desperately needed your input, especially today, and I was relieved to see you arrive.
Strangely, my own response to this incident has been to feel extremely weak and fatigued. I've read every word of the news coverage, and as many of the comment boards as I could stomach, but I just haven't been able to string together a coherent sentence to join the conversation--or even to express my sympathy to some friends and acquaintances I know were present when this happened.
Instead, I've slept too much, and seen my dreams permeated by reenactments of the shooting.
I don't know what's wrong with me recently, but I truly appreciate Elrod and others for being my voice right now.
Instead, I've slept too much, and seen my dreams permeated by reenactments of the shooting.
Sunday night I had nightmares all night long of people killing other people in various horrible ways.
I can't imagine how the people who were actually there on Sunday have been affected.
you might not get what your community really needs.
The communities touched by these could probably come up some solutions that people in DC or Boston wouldn't think of. The older I get, the less faith I have in national level politics and the more I see the importance and potential of local solutions to national/global problems. Even if you do have national or even global political resolve to take on an issue, these problems often take on geographically specific qualities that make local input on their resolution essential. So at any stage in the awakening process, local action is important. I agree that coordination at larger scales is a good idea, but inaction for fear of pissing in the wind, is well...unwarranted.
Also, if you read my message carefully, you will see that I am not asking local government to "demand" anything. I would like to see people come together in a public forum and share perspectives on what the problems are, and what the solutions may be. Wether the solutions involve government action or not is up to the thousands of people touched by this event to decide.
-Sugarfatpie (AKA Alex Pulsipher)
"X-Rays are a hoax."-Lord Kelvin
I've just been reading too much of the divisive comments on the KNS site, and it can make you lose hope. Instead, I need to remember the 100s of people that came out Monday night.
Thanks for dragging me back, I think I'm just going to stop reading the KNS comments altogether.
Its worth trying to bring folks around over there though. Get them off their high horses. People can really work themselves into a frenzy.
I went over there for a while and didn't even know where to begin. I finally ended up sending a note to the author of the KNS coverage to not leap to too many conclusions about Adkisson's motivations, which I think the articles do. I also found the wording of the 1st paragraph in yesterday's sentinel atrocious. Goes way to far towards promoting the shooter's views.
The shooting has laid bare some profoundly unmet needs in our community. I don't think we will know what those are until we have some face to face, community wide discussions of what our problems are.
PS I thought what you said to the news media on sunday regarding our need to take better care of the mentally ill was right on. Just the right thing to say at that time.
-Sugarfatpie (AKA Alex Pulsipher)
"X-Rays are a hoax."-Lord Kelvin
When we were searching for the three missing kids, I saw some worried people at the fence (she had a sister inside). When I went to help her, some media person said they heard an exagerrated figure of deaths/injuries, and I just snapped back that it wasn't right. The next thing I knew...
I just hope I did more good than harm that morning. We can see how damaging leaving the rumor mill can be.
I had wondered from the first moment about political motivation, but kept praying I was wrong. Even so, he had a lot of demons he was wrestling with. Maybe if self help books sold better than wingnut hit books....
far behind.
When people have no realistic job future in Knoxville and no way to escape to better opportunities, the social fabric deteriorates and the traditional rules of society get thrown out the door. This guy wasn't hungry, he was flat out pissed and had way too much time to think about it, plan on what he was going to do, and execute his plan. Had he had something industrius to do with his life (beyond working in a $10 a hour call center/no benefits or working in our wonder retail segments at Turkey Creek) perhaps he would have been more concerned about his own well being and not lashing out at others.
Local leadership needs to get off their fat arses and get out there and develop a local economy which is not based on government, not for profits, call centers or retail strip centers built by their developer buddies and financed by the taxpayers through TIFS. Come on Knoxville, get in the game.
“Most laws governing the treatment of mentally ill individuals assume that such individuals are competent to accept or reject treatment, with the sole exception of obvious dementia. Yet, contemporary research has established that up to half of all individuals with severe psychiatric disorders are not competent to assess their own need for treatment. The consequences of this misunderstanding have led to increasing numbers of mentally ill individuals who are homeless, incarcerated, and victimized, and increasing numbers of individuals who commit homicides and other violent acts. This misunderstanding underlies one of the great social disaster of late twentieth-century America.” Dr. Fuller Torrey in his book The Insanity Offense. "The sad truth that in many part of the country there is no mental health system,” says Michael J. Fitzpatrick, executive director of NAMI. In each of the preventable tragedies told in the book, there is a solution. “Dr. Torrey’s unflinching analysis shows that caring for severely mentally ill people is not impossible,” notes author Sally Satel, M.D. “It should be required reading on Capitol Hill and in state houses across the country.”
Kendra's Law requring mandatory outpatient treatment has been enacted and proven effective in New York. This law helps lessen preventable tragedies from occuring. Not only should mental health help be assessible to those who need it, it must be accepted by them. Kendra's Law assures court-ordered mandatory outpatient treatment for the untreated mentally ill individual at risk to themselves or others. Please support efforts for a Kendra's Law in Tennessee. Urge our legislators to reconsider senate bill 1269 in it's original form. For more information on Kendra's Law, go to the Treatment Advocacy Center's website at Link...
Are you talking lobotomies, drugs, therapy? The case of the shooter @ Virgina Tech wasn't he on some type of treatment or at least supposed to be? Hasn't it been proven that when someone has been on treatment for a prolonged time, that if they should somehow miss their treatments they become worse than what they were before they began their treatments?
"Kendra's Law requring mandatory outpatient treatment for the untreated mentally ill individual at risk to themselves"
We are all at risk to ourselves. Anyone who writes on a blog could be considered a risk to themselves or others. All of us seem to have an uncontrollable urge to blurt out(excluding this post)our opinions without knowing what consequences our posts may have on us and others. This law walks a fine line between thinking that you are helping someone's mental well being, and trampling on ones personal rights.
I could almost see it being mandatory if someone committed a serious crime and were incarcerated, but for a doctor to diagnose someone and then force them against their will to be treated. Well, there's just something in that law that seems immoral to me.
"proven effective in New York" (4 out of five doctors recommended!)
Effective to whom? The individual? The doctors who receive kick-backs for prescribing these drugs? or to the people who have to interact with these individuals? Is it only used to make other peoples lives easier?
Link...
When we get to the point of forcing someone to ingest a substance into their bodies against their will, it means we no longer have control of the only remaining sanctuary we have from this world. Our bodies! This not only affects the "mentally ill", this affects you, me, or anyone else. "All" freedom, let me repeat myself, "all" freedom is lost. To me, the fact that you think that this is okay makes you a possible danger to society. Maybe you should be considered for the treatment.
And like it or not, our bodies are regulated. We regulate how fast we can hurtle our bodies down the road, what we can do with the waste's our bodies create, and absolutely what we can do to others with our bodies.
I don't like the notion of someone being forced to take their meds, but I really don't like the idea of potential killers being off their meds and on the streets.
But this is only a part of the problem. As a previous post pointed out, mental health care has become a drug dispensing system. This is a symptom of resources being misdirected by our current health care system. We need much more preventive care and outreach to mentally unstable people. If we had that, Adkison might not have chosen the path he did. He might have received the help he needed.
I'd like to know more about how mental health is dealt with in Canada, and the EU. Anyone know anything about this?
Thanks
-Sugarfatpie (AKA Alex Pulsipher)
"X-Rays are a hoax."-Lord Kelvin
"We are all at risk to ourselves. Anyone who writes on a blog could be considered a risk to themselves or others. All of us seem to have an uncontrollable urge to blurt out(excluding this post)our opinions without knowing what consequences our posts may have on us and others. This law walks a fine line between thinking that you are helping someone's mental well being, and trampling on ones personal rights."
Haven't we had enough trampling on personal rights by untreated mental illness in our town ... just this year? David Rudd, Micah Johnson and now David Adkisson? To know that this trampling could have possibly been prevented by mandatory outpatient mental health treatment is a tragedy indeed. All I'm saying is Kendra's law makes good sense. 43 other states have it. Why doesn't Tennessee?
If anyone is interested in helping lobby the state legislature to enact Kendra's Law, please e-mail me at 'steve@reform4.com'.
Although we don't know if this would have prevented this particular tragedy (and from the legal definition, Adkisson is clearly legally 'sane'.. he knew the police would be coming, therefore he knew what he was doing was illegal), the issue of untreated mental illness still seems like a potential risk factor for future events.
Exerpt from Treatment Advocacy Center Briefing paper re: the effectiveness of Kendra's law in NY - especially note the last sentence.
Yes, there IS a potential risk posed by not responding to individuals in need and unfortunately Knoxvillians are now more than familiar with that risk.
"Kendra’s Law improves the system’s ability to help those in need
Not only is Kendra’s Law helping the individuals in the program, it is also helping the system better provide treatment to all those in need. The New York Office of Mental Health detailed some of these systemic benefits in its final report: "Counties and stakeholder groups statewide have reported that the implementation of processes to provide AOT to individuals under court orders has resulted in beneficial structural changes to local mental health service delivery systems… The implementation of AOT has also supported the development of more collaborative relationships between the mental health and court systems. AOT has been instrumental in increasing accountability at all system levels regarding delivery of services to high need individuals.”
The increased accountability led to a shift in the manner in which treatment to high need individuals was viewed: “Local mental health systems began to identify the potential risk posed by not responding to individuals in need, and as a result, those systems improved their ability to respond more efficiently and effectively.”"
See Knoxville Googled in the front of today's Metro Pulse, the piece from Huffington Post talks about how the right wing policies drives people like Adkisson to the breaking point and them tell him its all the liberal's fault, the piece says it well. Many, many people are at that breaking point, but they don't kill anyone beacuse they aren't mentally ill or sociopathic.
Post new comment