Tue
Apr 22 2008
08:37 pm
By: R. Neal

Cable news is saying it's too close to call. They are writing Clinton's obituary on MSNBC. Chris Matthews and Andrea Mitchell agree that Ed Rendell will be the one who has to have "the talk" with Clinton. Looks like a long night for the Clinton camp. Obama is in route to Indiana for a rally...

UPDATE: NBC has declared Clinton the projected winner. With 1% reporting, they have Clinton 60% to Obama 40%. With 0% reporting it was 65%/35%. I guess the margin will continue to narrow as the returns come in. The talk all night has been how narrow, and what does the Clinton margin have to be for her to raise enough money to go on.

UPDATE: 3% reporting, Clinton 53% Obama 47%.

UPDATE: 4% reporting, Clinton 57% Obama 43%. It's a roller coaster ride!

UPDATE: Final result: Clinton by 10, 55% to 45%, net six delegates. On to Puerto Rico!

Andy Axel's picture

They are writing Clinton's

They are writing Clinton's obituary on MSNBC.

I'm sure. I've been avoiding turning on the TV. I can only imagine that it looks like Matthews and Obamamann are ready to bust out the Cohibas.

____________________________

With the possible exception of things like box scores, race results, and stock market tabulations, there is no such thing as Objective Journalism. The phrase itself is a pompous contradiction in terms.

bill young's picture

Clinton wins

Fox says its Clinton

Indiana here we come

Pam Strickland's picture

CNN is talking about how bad

CNN is talking about how bad Obama is doing, and how he would be the next Dukakis in PA this fall. I think it's too early to be knocking anybody off.

Pam Strickland

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." ~Kurt Vonnegut

bill young's picture

+ 10%

Clinton's moving toward a +10 point win.

Dont look good for Obama right now.

Anonymously Nine's picture

Really? Link...

Really?

(link...)

bill young's picture

TIZZY

DAMN..98% of vote in

Clinton's ahead by 10.

We got to win us one.

Caddell says NC is soft for Obama.

May 6th is getting a SC feel

We need Indiana & NC.

Dont get those & FLA/Mich comes into play.

CBT's picture

Clinton was ahead in Pa.

Clinton was ahead in Pa. throughout, sometimes with 20+ point polling leads. A win was expected. The margin was the question. Comparing numbers three weeks back, Obama closed a bit on Hil's Pa. lead.

Interesting that CNN shows 59% of Dems who voted were women and 59% were 45 and over (with about half of that 59% over 60). Looks like those demos favor Hil.

Carole Borges's picture

You have to give Hillary credit

She fights like a dirty dog and that is apparently still very affective. She's still a long shot, but it remains to be seen if Obama can bear up under the mudslinging diversions her machine is spinning out at hyperspeed. He has obviously been pulling his punches and sometimes I myself feel like he should stoop to her level and have a go at all her many past corruptions, his impeachment. the deals with the Dubyai crowd, but then that would be doing politics as usual.

Sometimes winning at any cost just isn't worth selling your soul.

I think Obama should return to his inspiring message of change and hope and do what Bill and Hillary and McCain do. They simply refuse to answer any questions or apologize or even discuss anything that might make them look bad. They know how not to feed the media frenzy in a way Obama apperantly hasn't. He keeps trying to apologize and explain non-issues and this has hurt him.

So perhaps we might have to live through four more years of nasty politcs, backroom corporate deals, and double speak in the White House after all?

If Hillary should somehow pull the rabbit out of the hat everyone will be suspicious. I think most of Obama's supporters will stay home or, as some have suggested, throw away their vote by writing in his name somewhere on the ballot in protest.

The media has also played a part in this by hyping the Wright non-issue 24 hours a day and ignoring things like her threat to "obliterate Iran". This morning they have jumped onto her "elitist" bandwagon.

Hillary deserves credit for winning PA. No question about that. Obama hotly contested her original 24% lead, but she won and by a decent margin too. It shows she can work the machinery.

I was inspired by the audacity of hope, but to some people winning at any cost is the name of the game.

That's the reason our country is crumbling. The American people usually get exactly what they deserve. A brainwashed populace led by a president with a gadzillion secret agendas, no way of getting legislature passed, and a deaf ear when it comes to the people who elected them.

Go Hillary. You're on a slight roll here, but don't get too cocky. So far the voters have NOT chosen you to be the nominee.

It makes me cringe to think what slime is bubbling on the back of your stove right now.

If Obama tries to out Clinton the Clintons. I'm shutting off the TV until after November. I'm going back to my gardening.

"The general election? What election?"

Andy Axel's picture

it remains to be seen if

it remains to be seen if Obama can bear up under the mudslinging diversions her machine is spinning out at hyperspeed.

Get used to it. That's a game of beanbag compared to what the candidate TBD going to get from the GOP.

So perhaps we might have to live through four more years of nasty politcs, backroom corporate deals, and double speak in the White House after all?

I figure we'd get a large dose of that with Obama in the White House as well. Try explaining this to the saucer-eyed True Believers, though.

I was inspired by the audacity of hope, but to some people winning at any cost is the name of the game. That's the reason our country is crumbling.

Maybe it's not. Maybe it's the Audacity of Sheer Petulance like this: I think most of Obama's supporters will stay home or, as some have suggested, throw away their vote by writing in his name somewhere on the ballot in protest.

You sound like you're encouraging them, as you have been repeatedly hammering on this point at every opportunity since February.

It makes me cringe to think what slime is bubbling on the back of your stove right now.

Nice. So now Hillary is a witch? Or just some evil housewife?

Misogynist metaphor: Not just for men anymore.

____________________________

With the possible exception of things like box scores, race results, and stock market tabulations, there is no such thing as Objective Journalism. The phrase itself is a pompous contradiction in terms.

RayCapps's picture

I had missed this comment:

I was inspired by the audacity of hope, but to some people winning at any cost is the name of the game.

That's the reason our country is crumbling. The American people usually get exactly what they deserve.

If dirty campaigning, negative campaigning, name calling, misdirection, and character assassination will lead to our nation crumbling, it's at least a very, very slow process. Dukakis in the tank, Willie Horton, Swift Boating, Obama's pastor and weatherman friends, and Bosnian sniper fire are penny ante, half hearted, softballs compared to the type of campaigning this nation was founded upon.

Look back to the first openly contested, two party presidential contest in our history. Adams vs. Jefferson - signers of the Declaration and both leaders and allies in the movement toward absolute separation from Britain. Jefferson supporters flatly accused Adams of treason, of being a monarchist eager to place the fledgling nation back under Britain's protective wing, or contrariwise, attempting to rule the nation as a king himself - especially through the powers of the alien and sedition act, which at least gave these charges a little bit of factual cladding. As I recall, some even accused Adams of being ruled by his wife (an unthinkable charge in that day and age). Adams supporters accused Jefferson of treason, of wanting the United States to sell out (to use a modern term) to France, and the Adams camp's rumors of pedophilia and other perversions regarding Jefferson are still repeated today (with some strong DNA evidence supporting the claim either Thomas or his brother fathered children through a Monticello slave). Campaigns are ugly things. There really isn't a "high road" just various levels of "low roads" to travel.

As for the type of government Americans get, we generally get the type of government enough of us want badly enough to insist upon loud enough and long enough to bring into being. Our system of goverance was deliberately designed from top to bottom and from the very beginning to squash radicalism and to make wholesale, sweeping changes of national direction nearly impossible to achieve. And every significant shift in one direction that is achieved is met by an immediate backlash and quite often entirely reversed.

What kind of government do we have? At the root of it, we have pretty much the type of government James Madison wanted us to have, since he essentially wrote our Constitution. To understand what kind of government that is, you have study who James Madison was as a person, what drove him, and what his vision was. Personally, I think it's hilarious our whole system of national governance was the vision of someone so "nerdy" that today he'd never stand a chance of being elected to anything.

Very short version, Carole, get a grip. We'll survive.

Justin's picture

Threadjack...did anyone else

Threadjack...did anyone else happen to watch the HBO series 'John Adams'? Damn good even if they played around with the timeline in a few spots in order to make it entertaining...now back to the arguing.

Rachel's picture

If Hillary should somehow

If Hillary should somehow pull the rabbit out of the hat everyone will be suspicious. I think most of Obama's supporters will stay home or, as some have suggested, throw away their vote by writing in his name somewhere on the ballot in protest.

Then shame on 'em. Regardless of whether you like Hillary or her campaign tactics, if you care about Obama's issues (rather than just Obama), you'd better vote for the Democrat, whoever it is.

McCain's not going to do better at delivering Obama-like policy than Hillary. Not to mention Supreme Court appts.

I have no patience with the "if my candidate loses, I'll take my toys and go home" crap, no matter whose supporters it comes from.

Anonymous's picture

Message of Change

and exactly what is this message of change? I would like to see some real details on this message of change.

smalc's picture

My in-laws are staunch

My in-laws are staunch Republicans in a very rural, Republican Pennsylvania county (even more Republican than Blount or Loudon counties here).

The MIL declared, "I can't believe anyone in Fulton County would vote for Obama, after all that's who we are fighting over there."

It just makes your head hurt.

Plus the FIL is registered as a Democrat (they have closed primaries) so that he can cast a vote for the Democrat he likes least. I haven't heard who he voted for.

bizgrrl's picture

even more Republican than

even more Republican than Blount or Loudon counties here

Hah! I just can't fathom this would be possible.

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