Tue
Jul 5 2016
12:16 pm
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Discussing:
- MAP: See the number of SNAP participants by Tennessee county as benefit lapse looms (1 reply)
- GOP dereliction of duty, SNAP must be funded (3 replies)
- Tennessee sheriff defends jailing liberal activist for posting Trump meme (2 replies)
- Terrible things are happening outside. (5 replies)
- Medicare Advantage: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver (1 reply)
- Electricity prices are rising (2 replies)
- Does Silly Congress care about chaos in cattle market? (4 replies)
- East TN Health Depts. free flu shots today, Oct. 21, 2025 (1 reply)
- Building housing Knox County Democratic Party headquarters up for sale (3 replies)
- Watch how scam victims lose millions to a con with a modern twist (1 reply)
- Knoxville SOUP proposals Announced for Sept. 23, 2025 (1 reply)
- No Kings Rally - Saturday, Oct. 18, 2025 (1 reply)
TN Progressive
- WATCH THIS SPACE. (Left Wing Cracker)
- Report on Blount County, TN, No Kings event (BlountViews)
- America As It Is Right Now (RoaneViews)
- A friend sent this: From Captain McElwee's Tall Tales of Roane County (RoaneViews)
- The Meidas Touch (RoaneViews)
- Massive Security Breach Analysis (RoaneViews)
- (Whitescreek Journal)
- Lee's Fried Chicken in Alcoa closed (BlountViews)
- Alcoa, Hall Rd. Corridor Study meeting, July 30, 2024 (BlountViews)
- My choices in the August election (Left Wing Cracker)
- July 4, 2024 - aka The Twilight Zone (Joe Powell)
- Chef steals food to serve at restaurant? (BlountViews)
TN Politics
- Trump administration blocked from cutting off SNAP benefits as two judges issue orders (TN Lookout)
- Kilmar Abrego Garcia to be transferred to Tennessee for hearings on criminal charges (TN Lookout)
- Despite bipartisan lawmakers’ urging, Lee declines to bridge SNAP freeze with state dollars (TN Lookout)
- Stockard on the Stump: National Guard could roam Memphis streets for a year (TN Lookout)
- States prepare for rapid price changes as Congress mulls Obamacare subsidies (TN Lookout)
- Food assistance funding cliff approaching as shutdown persists (TN Lookout)
Knox TN Today
- WBHOF calls for Candace Parker (Knox TN Today)
- AMBC Fall Festival + Bazillion Blooms + TPO road plan + SoKno Pub Crawl ++ (Knox TN Today)
- Local Humane Society is a 2025 ‘Best of Tennessee’ winner (Knox TN Today)
- Jane Goodall: A voice in the animal kingdom (Knox TN Today)
- HEADLINES: World & national news to state & local news (Knox TN Today)
- Dining Duo goes to Golden Oak (Knox TN Today)
- Knox shares Grogans’ trip to Italy (Knox TN Today)
- Global growth in renewable energy (Knox TN Today)
- West Prong Trail offers bears, hogs and beauty (Knox TN Today)
- Food City supports the Empty Stocking Fund (Knox TN Today)
- Bill Woodrick calls for post-funeral lunch and party (Knox TN Today)
- How about that new camera, Badger? (Knox TN Today)
Local TV News
- Ella, beloved Anderson County kickoff tee retriever, retires after seven seasons (WATE)
- 'It takes 60 votes': Burchett blames Senate Democrats for shutdown as service members face uncertainty (WATE)
- Food pantries in East Tennessee see surge in demand ahead of potential SNAP delays (WATE)
- 'Food is important' Knoxville nonprofit helping mothers as WIC program faces uncertainty (WATE)
- Knoxville police make 31 arrests around downtown, Old City (WATE)
- Jury acquits Oak Ridge school bus driver in assault case (WATE)
News Sentinel
State News
- Chattanooga Now Events - Blake Worthington: City of Red Bank Traffic Garden - Chattanooga Times Free Press (Times Free Press)
- Vols, Sooners pitting SEC’s strength against strength in Neyland - Chattanooga Times Free Press (Times Free Press)
- Wamp says county will take public input for Enterprise South, McDonald Farm swap into 2026 - Chattanooga Times Free Press (Times Free Press)
- Mocs expect little things to be huge against Western Carolina - Chattanooga Times Free Press (Times Free Press)
Wire Reports
- Trump touts Lincoln Bathroom overhaul featuring marble, gold fixtures - The Washington Post (US News)
- Trump administration must release billions in SNAP funds, judge says - The Washington Post (US News)
- US to Announce Nexperia Chip Shipments From China to Resume - Bloomberg (Business)
- Trump wants to shatter the filibuster, another Senate norm. Republicans are pushing back. - Axios (US News)
- Judge Permanently Bars Trump From Requiring Proof of Citizenship for Voter Registration - The New York Times (US News)
- Judge grants Connecticut woman accused of holding stepson captive access to new alias, address - NBC News (US News)
- FAA warns of ‘surge’ in air traffic controllers calling out of work - Politico (US News)
- Apple stock closes slightly down following Q4 2025 report - 9to5Mac (Business)
- Trump faces critical point in government shutdown, SNAP cutoff - ABC News (US News)
- US retailers are running out of pennies - BBC (Business)
- Kash Patel says FBI thwarted alleged ‘terrorist attack’ in Michigan - Al Jazeera (US News)
- Wall Street Confronts Fed Doubts as Bill Gross Sells Treasuries - Bloomberg (Business)
- Football Fans Scrambling After ESPN, ABC, Disney Pulled From YouTube TV - CNET (Business)
- Three billionaires dropped by a fried-chicken joint—and Jensen Huang bought everyone dinner - Fortune (Business)
- Amazon CEO says layoffs aren't about AI, as cuts spark job apocalypse panic - Axios (Business)
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Comey tried to change the law today
(link...)
Intent is irrelevant. It is not part of the law. Comey is wrong. Ask David Petraeus.
Intent is not irrelevant.
It doesn't appear the FBI was able to establish an actual breach. This would mean that the case against HRC is extremely weak, and likely overturned even if a witch hunt proved successful.
intent does not matter
(in reply to fischbobber)
(link...)
You are mistaken.
In this case......
Intent is written into the law. The fact that no breaches were allowed shows an intent to comply and a de facto compliance of the statute. This bird won't fly with a competent jury. I can promise you Herb Moncier could get her off the hook.
Gross negligence cannot
(in reply to fischbobber)
Gross negligence cannot involve intent. Keep up. And it isn't written into the law.
Without a breach, there is no negligence.
There is a vast difference between an error in judgement, and intentionally committing a criminal act. The proof of the information being unsecured would be a breach in the system. They didn't find a breach, hence, you have a highly technical argument that will come back to whether or not there was, in fact, a breach. The underlying assumption would have to be that Clinton was incompetent. That argument would be proven false. Regardless of whether or not she was in technical compliance of a regulation, the fact that there is no breach shows her to be within the boundaries of the intent of the law, if not the letter.
Without a breach, there is no negligence.
(in reply to fischbobber)
Missed that one. Even more wrong than your idiotic claim of intent. There a link to the law below. Trying reading it this time.
(link...)
*
(in reply to fischbobber)
It appears to me that this Item (f) is the applicable text.
Looks like she was "entrusted with" and "(had) lawful possession...of...information" which she treated with "gross negligence" in allowing it "to be removed from its proper place of custody," namely a secure government server.
Rudy Giuliani words as well.
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
Rudy Giuliani words as well.
*
(in reply to bizgrrl)
I'm sorry, I didn't catch the reference? Giuliani commented on the need for texts to Clinton's Wall Street speeches or the applicability of this section of the Code I copied to her actions as Sec of State?
In either event, what did he say?
What you said.
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
What you said.
The law was written in the 1940s.
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
It doesn't require the proper place of custody to be a secure government server, as per your definition.
This is not about whether Hillary deviated from standard operating protocol, which let's face it, is what her detractors are insisting this is about. The baseline for all these laws is to stop people from committing acts of treason.
Just because one might have an issue with Clinton's propensity to do things her way, regardless of circumstance, that doesn't make her a treasonist. Unless there is a vast cache of information being withheld, I don't see a conviction coming out of this.
Plus, given the nature of her system upgrades, per the FBI, one could reasonably argue that she was indeed in compliance with the statute. The issue would become whether or not the Secretary of State was high enough up on the food chain to make good faith decisions on her own. Then it becomes her word against anonymous bloggers.
(The rules for sending and receiving classified correspondence are vast. It would be vital to the case to know specifics of any questionable correspondence in order to draw a rational conclusion. I would point out, the public doesn't have those specifics.)
*
(in reply to fischbobber)
No, Bob. It is not just "my definition" that the "proper place of custody" for classified e-mails is a secure government server. It is the ruling of multiple DOJ actions charging felony violation of this same Federal statute--at least seven of them over the years since Obama took office.
Do take a look at this overview of some of those cases as contained in the letter from the House Judiciary Committee to Comey yesterday. They've called him in. Think I read elsewhere that he's to testify before them tomorrow.
Postscript
(in reply to fischbobber)
I just wrapped up a quick attempt to collect a little more background on these seven cases the DOJ has prosecuted under the Espionage Act during Obama's administration.
It looks like the Nishimura case wasn't the only one involving the defendent storing classified docs on unauthorized computers (absent any intent on the defendent's part to share those docs with unauthorized persons); the White case also centered on this same concern (also absent any intent on the defendent's part to share those docs with unauthorized persons).
These two cases most closely mirror the Clinton circumstances, then, while the other five cases turned on defendents actually sharing classified info in some way with parties to whom it should not have been privy.
See details on Nishimura and White cases here.
Intent is an element of just
Intent is an element of just about every crime. No intent, no crime.
This is EXACTLY the result predicted for months. Can we move on now?
"Intent is an element of just
(in reply to Rachel)
"Intent is an element of just about every crime."
It does not pertain to gross negligence. Like Comey, you all are trying to change the law.
So on June 30, Loretta Lynch
So on June 30, Loretta Lynch meets with Bill Clinton.
On July 1st, Lynch pledges to follow the recommendations of the FBI on prosecution of the email case.
On July 3, "aides close to Mrs. Clinton" suggest she may keep Loretta Lynch on as AG.
And today there's an announcement that there will be no prosecution.
I'm trying to swallow my cynicism.
*
(in reply to Knoxoasis)
I'm trying to remain patient while I wait for those transcripts of her multiple half-million dollar speeches to Wall Street. It's been fully five months since she first promised voters she'd "look into" it.
As concerning as are these possible breaches of classified information, I worry as much or more that she's made assurances to Wall Street that would bring harm to us, too. And more personally.
The thing is...
Even without Bill Clinton's tarmac blunder last week, an FBI conclusion not to recommend charges would have resulted in proclamations that 'the fix is in' anyway.
As with Whitewater and Benghazi, for those who don't like the Clintons, no investigation or finding of fact is believed to be valid, unless it proclaims boldly "they did it!"
As flawed as they may be as human beings, when you consider that quite literally hundreds of millions of dollars have been spent to investigate potential wrongdoing by the Clintons, with nothing of real consequence to show for it. If that much time and money was spent investigating pretty much anyone (much less any politician), who would come out of it any better?
I also find it interesting to
(in reply to Somebody)
I also find it interesting to note that the FBI closely read 30,000 of Hillary Clinton's emails and not only didn't find sufficient evidence to press charges on this specific issue, but also didn't find evidence of any other crime. Comey noted that there was no apparent obstruction of justice, and no apparent intent to withhold any evidence. Less than four tenths of one percent of the emails contained information that Comey says she should have known at the time was inappropriate for transmission through unsecured media. (You want that number to actually be zero, but 4/10 of 1% is pretty close to zero.)
The popular supposition is that Mrs. Clinton is habitually sleazy and crooked, yet the FBI can comb through all of her work email and not turn up anything worth bringing charges?
I wonder if the same thing would result if the FBI combed through four years worth of Donald Trump's email? I bet not.
*
(in reply to Somebody)
Ah, but I find it "interesting" to note that the FBI did find sufficient evidence to press charges on this exact same issue WRT Nishimuru and White. Don't you think that a cabinet member should be held to a higher standard than they, not a lower one?
Also, your math as to the percentage of Clinton's e-mails that were classified discounts another "roughly 2,000" Comey says were "up-classified" after the fact, which makes that percentage of classified e-mails around seven percent, not one-half of one percent. This process of "up-classifying" documents after the fact doesn't pose any problem WRT exchanges on secure servers, but it may well pose problems WRT exchanges on one's personal devices.
And I'm sure we agree that Donald Trump isn't a standard bearer for much of anything--but isn't your observation yet another instance of a Clinton supporter arguing only that at least his candidate isn't quite so flawed as Trump? Sounded like it to me...
I think you're going to get
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
I think you're going to get whatever you want out of whatever you read.
Secured servers
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
It's my understanding that a secured server only sends, it doesn't receive. In other words, there is this inference that the e-mails in question have the distinction of being some sort of totality of her correspondence, yet if on looks at her time of service and even considering the up-grading of the e-mails in question, that could not mathematically be true. Nor would the way events unfolded during her time as Secretary of State suggest that someone had tapped into her e-mails and classified correspondence.
Use your head. Do you think we get Bin Laden if Clinton's classified correspondence is compromised? Do you think we topple Ghadaffi? (Granted, one can argue whether or not that was a good thing)
There is a broad line of thought and consequence that would accompany Clinton's guilt in this matter, and it simply isn't there. Truthfully, we don't even know, at our level, whether or not the "classified" correspondence were deliberate leaks or not.
At Secretary Clinton's level, things are a bit more complex and nuanced than you are allowing.
P.S.
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
I shouldn't follow up no this, because you won't care, but what the heck.
The Constitution specifically prohibits passage of ex post facto laws and bills of attainder. This means, in effect, you can't 'up-classify' information after the fact and then turn around and prosecute someone for having previously sent that 'up-classified' information by unsecured means. So while 'up-classified' emails are of mild interest, they don't matter here.
...But
(in reply to Somebody)
it's somewhat heartwarming to see the Bernie Bullies and the wingnut GOP making common cause, and coming unhinged in harmony.
You're factually wrong.
(in reply to Andy Axel)
Sanders said monthes ago this was nothing and most of us has proceeded as such. Don't mistake people motivated by a shared support of Sanders platform and vision and those that simply hate Hillary. Despite the obvious overlap of the groups they're two distinct schools of thought.
I can factually read
(in reply to fischbobber)
I've observed a certain strain of #NeverHillary dead-enders embracing the same schools of thought as Paul Ryan and his cohort. Not even a gym teacher could get so many kids to dress alike, so to speak.
If you've got friends or family that work at Oak Ridge
ask them if intent is required under 18 USC 973, many a good worker, scientist, and lab worker has been lost to this statute without any evidence of intent to remove, duplicate, or copy any of the classified defense department information involved in the situation. Comey's interpretation of the statute creates more questions about the veracity and the integrity of our government than it solves.
Comey knows he is wrong
(in reply to Roscoe Persimmon)
Congress should move on this today. Comey's "interpretation" is a criminal act. And it undermines national security.
Watergate was nothing compared to what happened today.
Brief historical note
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
"On the night of March 10, 2004, Comey had learned that Gonzales, then the White House counsel, and Andrew Card, the White House chief of staff, were heading to a Washington hospital, where John Ashcroft, the Attorney General, suffering from gallstone pancreatitis, was in intensive care. Gonzales and Card wanted Ashcroft to reauthorize a government surveillance program that Comey and his staff had concluded was unlawful. Comey and Robert Mueller III, the F.B.I. director, raced, sirens blaring, to beat Gonzales and Card to Ashcroft’s bedside. In a tense confrontation at the hospital, Ashcroft told Gonzales and Card that, since Comey was Acting Attorney General, the decision was his to make."
Remember that? Ok, what were you saying about his integrity?
New Yorker
his integrity
(in reply to S Carpenter)
His integrity doesn't exist after today. Twelve years ago was then. Today is now.
Well
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
... you're the expert. Make your case, explain how they got to him.
No doubt
(in reply to Roscoe Persimmon)
How the hell does this country classify emails anyway? Colin Powell has some experience with that.
you mean like this?
(in reply to Roscoe Persimmon)
(link...)
(link...)
How is this Clinton issue any different? It's not. Comey should be indicted for obstruction of justice. This is not the cover-up of a 'third rate burglary'. Nothing has ever been at this level or corruption.
The law as if it matters...
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
Reading this as a layperson, one might think, 'How could it not be negligent to have top-secret material on your personal email account?' Except that this is an espionage statute, not lay language, and this law has been interpreted to have a very specific meaning.
In 1941, the U.S. Supreme Court heard a case which challenged whether the phrase "national defense" in this very espionage law was too vague and over-broad. The answer was no only because:
"We find no uncertainty in this statute which deprives a person of the ability to predetermine whether a contemplated action is criminal under the provisions of this law. The obvious delimiting words in the statute are those requiring intent or reason to believe that the information to be obtained is to be used to the injury of the United States, or to the advantage of any foreign nation. This requires those prosecuted to have acted in bad faith."
From the ABCnews link posted by SnM
*
(in reply to S Carpenter)
No, that ABC News link SnM posted, which is dated April 2016 but which originally appeared on the author Abram's blog in January 2016, is six months old. Abrams' multiple assumptions back then as to what the investigation's findings would be were disproven by the FBI's Comey yesterday.
Note that Abrams stated Rice and Powell had only received similar e-mails, but apparently hadn't sent them, on their personal servers, while Clinton both received and sent them.
Also note that Abrams stated these e-mails had been deemed classified only after the fact, while some of Clinton's e-mails had been deemed classified at the time she received and sent them (and some were also labeled as such, Comey reported).
Finally note that Abrams concedes Clinton is the only Sec of State never to have used an @state.gov e-mail account at all.
Specifically what Abrams said as to the classification status of certain Clinton e-mails at the time she received or sent them was "none of the info she possessed...had been classified at that time."
What Comey said yesterday of Clinton's e-mail, though, is that "seven e-mail chains...were classisifed at the Top Secret/Special Access Program level when they were sent and received." Comey also noted yesterday that an additional volume of her e-mail was "properly classified as Secret by the U. S. Intelligence Community at the time it was discussed on e-mail." And again, he said some of it was labeled as such.
Abrams appears to contradict himself when he concedes in one breath that WRT 18 U.S.C.A. 793 (f), the felony statute, intent is not addressed in the law's language, then turns right around and argues that this same statute may not be applied to suspects whose intent is not in question.
And furthermore, we know that the felony statute has been applied to suspects whose intent is not in question, in particular to this Bryan Nishimura whom the DOJ successfully prosecuted just a few years back, per Confused Spectator's above link.
And further furthermore, that other link CS offered us, which reminds us that Bill Clinton's CIA Director John M. Deutch was also sucessfully prosecuted (under the misdemeanor statute, apparently, which does require intent?), makes it doubly hard to understand why Hillary Clinton would think this behavior is acceptable.
We can't read selectively all those links above. We have to read all of 'em--and the assumptions Abram made on his blog six months ago were superceded by the FBI's statement yesterday.
Clinton broke the law
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
"Abrams appears to contradict himself when he concedes in one breath that WRT 18 U.S.C.A. 793 (f), the felony statute, intent is not addressed in the law's language, then turns right around and argues that this same statute may not be applied to suspects whose intent is not in question."
Clinton broke the law. Comey tried to change the law on the fly to protect her. Which I think is obstruction of justice. Congress should act to remove Comey. And have Clinton arrested.
The intellectual dishonesty from the talking heads has no parallel. Real names of intelligence operatives were on unsecured Servers. The gross negligence is apparent and abundant.
ANALYSIS: Sorry, But There
ANALYSIS: Sorry, But There Still Isn't Enough to Prosecute Hillary Clinton
(link...)
Perspectives; thankful for Trump's incompetence?
Breakdowns from Ian Milhiser at ThinkProgress.
Glenn Greenwald at the Intercept
Couldn't "function effectively" without private servers? C'mon.
(in reply to Mike Knapp)
How ThinkProgress sees this:
How the FBI sees this:
I believe someone at ThinkProgress needs to think long and hard about what constitutes "effective" function of the State Department.
The optics
She would have been better served to get a hand-slap. A fine, rebuke, whatever.
The optics of "nothing" is the worst option for her politically.
From the tarmac, to the FBI meeting, to Comey's announcement to the joint rally appearance with the President - the optics and timing are terrible. Innocent or not.
When your highest negatives center around trust, you try to overcome the issue - not solidify it.
Agreed
(in reply to Average Guy)
And frankly, it's on these fronts that losing the enthusiastic support of Sanders followers will hurt her most come fall. Those of us being pushed to the independent status do not tend to lean to the left.
Attorney General Loretta E.
Attorney General Loretta E. Lynch released the following statement today regarding the State Department email investigation:
“Late this afternoon, I met with FBI Director James Comey and career prosecutors and agents who conducted the investigation of Secretary Hillary Clinton’s use of a personal email system during her time as Secretary of State. I received and accepted their unanimous recommendation that the thorough, year-long investigation be closed and that no charges be brought against any individuals within the scope of the investigation.”
Her integrity is the same as Comey's
(in reply to bizgrrl)
They should be be charged with obstruction of justice. The cover-up here is much worse than Watergate.
"The cover-up here is much
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
"The cover-up here is much worse than Watergate."
You keep saying that.
How was it?
just one example
(in reply to SnM)
(link...)
The way chain of evidence was handled was without precedent for abuse.
"Why does this matter? Because Clinton signed documents declaring she had turned over all of her work-related emails. We now know that is not true. But even more importantly, the absence of emails raises troubling questions about the nature of the correspondence that might have been deleted."
"Oh but she's better than Trump", tell yourself that when she sells you out. To China, or the Saudi's. Or Wall Street. She will sell you out. She always does.
How pathological does she have to be for your tribalism to be shaken? A much worse crook than Nixon. And much more dangerous to this country.
And like Nixon, it is only a matter of time before the bough breaks. She will be convicted for something some day. The FBI traded its credibility, you will do the same?
An editor for Breitbart says
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
An editor for Breitbart says there are gaps in Clinton's email count, which he says reminds him of the missing minutes on Nixon's secret tape recordings, and therefore, Clinton is a worse crook than Nixon?
Where's the beef?
Where are the plumbers? Where are the break-ins? Where're the funds from the Committee to Reelect the President? Where's the Saturday Night Massacre?
Interestingly, "All the President's Men" is on TCM tonight.
(link...)
(link...)
Done.
Oh good grief. You clearly
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
Oh good grief. You clearly were not around in 1972-74.
The whole thing just seems sloppy to me
I'm extremely irritated with Clinton for 1) setting up her own server so she has all control 2) mixing her private and work emails together and 3) not understanding or caring about the repercussions.
It was all stupid and very arrogant. Gawd, this is what irks me about her! Having said that, there were probably all kinds of breaches or wrongdoings by many on those threads of emails who just didn't stop and think. That could be a matter of ignorance, innocence or just plain sloppiness and doesn't show intent. Some of it is just plain age and inexperience with excessive use of email. But being in such a high position, they should know better!
Having said all that, Hillary Clinton is our nominee, and good or bad, she's still much better than Trump, who would be a complete disaster in any kind of security position, Hillary is far from perfect and definitely not my ideal, but I shudder to think what breaches Trump would commit if given the chance. God help us.
I agree with everything
(in reply to Dahlia)
I agree with everything you said.
scope of FBI investigation on Clinton
Is being expanded right now in the Congressional Oversight Committee.
Comey is not doing well. "Did Hillary Clinton lie under oath?" Comey, "to the FBI". Why anyone would risk their career to protect Clinton is puzzling. She can't out run this. With expanded scope, Comey will get sucked in to the cover-up.
You forgot the "not"
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
You misquoted Comey.
I missed the ? mark
(in reply to jmcnair)
I left off the ? mark. Unintentional typo.
Where did you get "Not to the FBI. Not in a case we're working." Did Comey actually say that today? How in the hell would he know? They "forgot" to put her under oath.
Bad troll needs better facts.
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
Bad troll needs better facts.
is this better?
(in reply to R. Neal)
"Hillary Clinton gave people without a security clearance access to her private server that contained classified information, FBI director James Comey told a congressional panel on Thursday.
The FBI director said between two and 10 individuals without clearances had access to the server, including Clinton’s attorneys who sorted her emails before they were turned over to the State Department."
So why isn't this intent and actually worse than General Petraeus? He only gave it to one person, she gave it to several, including her attorneys who destroyed work emails, destroyed evidence.
(link...)
Good bye.
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
You bore me.
They "forgot" to put her
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
Keep trying. Comey noted that it's illegal to lie to the FBI. They didn't need to put her under oath.
There is no transcript
(in reply to Somebody)
(link...)
"Yet the revelations will nonetheless raise questions among Republicans, who have been skeptical of the FBI’s investigation and have demanded to see the transcript of the former secretary of State’s interview in downtown Washington on Saturday.
“Well, that’s a problem,” Rep. John Mica (R-Fla.) told Comey when the FBI chief explained the terms of the interview.
"It's pretty clear ... that the American people would like to see what Hillary Clinton said to the FBI," Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) told reporters on Wednesday, a day before Comey’s appearance before House lawmakers.
Under FBI policy — and to the dismay of civil libertarians and staunch transparency advocates — the bureau does not conduct electronic recordings of interviews."
How does that happen?
I don't know why people keep
I don't know why people keep going on about Comey. Of course she wasn't indicted, of course Comey could only report on serious defects in judgment and attention to duty (Clinton's) in the most searing language possible.
And of course that flew right over everybody's heads, esp in the Republican camp. There was a very good analysis of how Republicans missed a golden opportunity to turn Comey's report into a ready made package of attack ads and talking points against Clinton's fitness to hold the office of president. Instead, Trump whines on Twitter and pundits like Glenn Reynolds write sarcastic columns about the FBI. Jesu, folks, the Clintons are making this easy for you, serving up attack stew right to your table, and you can't even smell it because you're too busy making fun of the server.
It's just another example of how the Clintons always land on their feet. They have always counted on their enemies to underestimate their (Clintons') advantages and miss their (Republicans') opportunities. It's how Hillary can and probably will win. A smarter opponent with craftier advisers would be steaming full speed ahead to the White House after this debacle. If Trump really does win, it won't be because he or the party did anything right.
are you watching the Congressional Oversight Committee now?
(in reply to Hildegard)
"I don't know why people keep going on about Comey."
Comey is committing perjury right now. He is sinking Clinton too.
In other words, the sideshow
(in reply to Confused Spectator)
In other words, the sideshow continues.
Congressional Oversight Committee
(in reply to Hildegard)
Which sideshow?
(link...)
"Hillary Clinton was not put under oath and there is no transcript of her interview with the FBI, Director James Comey told Congress on Thursday.
Mr. Comey said it’s still a crime if she lied to his agents — though he said he doesn’t believe that happened."
Tribalists, will you choose to throw away your integrity like Comey has?
It's time for Biden or someone else. Or this Democratic party no longer exists.
Good analysis.
(in reply to Hildegard)
+1
Comry said today, "there are
Comey said today, "there are all kinds of folks watching this at home are being told well lots of other cases were prosecuted and she wasn't. I want them to know that's not true."
Rs continuing to
Rs continuing to "investigate" (i.e. cry "wah wah" because they didn't get the answer they wanted) may excite the base but it will make independents/undecideds roll their eyes and say "THAT again?"
Okay with me, tho - go ahead and overreach. I sincerely hope they call Hillary in for another 11 hours of testimony so she can hand them their genitals again.
As for House Rs impugning the integrity of James Comey, THAT is not only overreach, it's a big mistake. Comey is well-respected on both sides of the aisle.
big mistake?
(in reply to Rachel)
The big mistake was when the FBI did not put Clinton under oath. How does that happen?
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USA Today (9:45 pm): State Department reopens Clinton emails probe
Hillary Clinton's sloppy,
Hillary Clinton's sloppy, arrogant, cavalier and shockingly ignorant treatment of confidential information deserves a good, honest, impartial, thorough latest GOP investigation into the latest unveiling of the rabbit hole out of which will pop Vince Foster's body with attached a Hillary-written confession to either killing him or driving him to suicide (taster's choice), all of the Whitewater records that prove she was behind the scheme to bilk everyone in the world of everything (and how she almost succeeded!), photographs of her lesbian college affairs (interracial and with men too!), the white papers on her failed attempt to force Muricuh into socialism through healthcare, the dress she gave Monica to wear to get semen on it in order to divorce Bill and marry her interracial lesbian male lover while spitting on the grave of BENGHAZI ambassador Stevens, and getting millions in donations from those who flew the jets on 9/11 also while casually betraying Muricawatsis to foreign interests with Bill because, well, you know, COS. Just because. Or something.
Because, for 25 years, the Clintons have been selling out this country. They have, in fact, sold the USA's nuclear arsenal code to Kim Jong Il simply to find out how he got Trump to praise him. Because they are so desperate, after killing everyone they know, lying about everything they know, selling everything they think they know, they have nothing to do except to ape Trump, who is a pillar of truth, modesty, restraint and everything that is HUGE.
OR Hillary Clinton's sloppy, arrogant, cavalier and shockingly ignorant treatment of confidential information deserves a significant rebuke. Which Director Comey delivered.
It's a sad, pathetic, tiny universe in which Americans live. And they think it's the world.
Good luck to you.
This. ^^^
(in reply to SnM)
This. ^^^
Well said, McNutt.And
Well said, McNutt.
And Tamara? How long can you go on and on and on and on and on and on? To what end?
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(in reply to Bbeanster)
It does appear that we won't agree. I ask you and others here to recognize that I have not and would not drag into this conversation anything related to former Dem candidate Bernie Sanders nor have I or would I care to make any comparisons between Clinton's infractions WRT her e-mail practices and Nixon's infractions WRT the Watergate break-in.
What I have been trying to examine--and I'm the only person in this converation who has been--is whether the FBI's/DOJ's response to Clinton's infractions appears to be in keeping with their response to the seemingly identical infractions of others before her.
As I shared yesterday, among the seven cases the DOJ has prosecuted during Obama's administration and which were cited in the House Judiciary Committee's letter to Comey that I linked, it appears that five of those cases involved suspects who actually shared classified information with bloggers, reporters, and biographers not authorized to have it.
Obviously, Clinton did not share classified information with those sorts of people. She did, however, allow access to the information to two to ten parties lacking any security clearance who serviced her devices while she was Sec of State. She also allowed access to classified information to an unknown number of attorneys lacking any security clearance who "scrubbed" 31,000 e-mails from her devices ("several thousand" worked-related ones later recovered by the FBI, Comey said), this latter incident in response to the FBI's request for her records.
To the extent that this parallel may be made between what the five prosecuted did in the way of sharing info with unauthorized persons and what Clinton did in the way of sharing info with unauthorized persons, it does not seem inappropriate to make a careful comparison of the particulars between the cases.
Even if we should find no valid comparsion exists between Clinton's case and any of these five others, though, there remains this question of why the DOJ prosecuted the other two of the seven cases, namely the cases of Bryan Nishimura (2015) and Chief Petty Officer Lyle White (2014).
As I also shared yesterday, Nishimura's case, which is being fairly widely discussed among media, wasn't the only one involving the defendent storing classified docs on unauthorized computers (absent any intent on the defendent's part to share those docs with unauthorized persons); the less-discussed case of White also centered on this same concern (also absent any intent on the defendent's part to share those docs with unauthorized persons). Both parties were found guilty and fined and/or stripped of security clearances.
It is especially egregious that neither Dems in the House nor posters in this conversation have offered any explanation or retort as to why the FBI's/DOJ's discrepant response in these two cases.
It will be more egregious still if, per the apparent prediction of media reports last night, the Dept of State should resume its internal investifation of Clinton's underlings and render discipline to them but not to her.
So these are the reasons I go "on and on." For these reasons, and because similar situations will almost certainly arise in the future, whomever wins this election.
As I posted previously, Comey
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
As I posted previously,
Comey said today, "there are all kinds of folks watching this at home are being told well lots of other cases were prosecuted and she wasn't. I want them to know that's not true."
Maybe the public doesn't have all of the details, which could easily be considering the issues at hand .
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(in reply to bizgrrl)
I saw that you shared that yesterday, Biz, but Comey didn't support that blanket assertion with any details of the sort I'm seeking (and that I think all of us should be seeking).
What is the distinction to be made between how the Clinton matter has been handled in 2016 and how the Nishimura and White matters were handled in 2015 and 2014? No one here has answered me that and it wasn't a rhetorical question.
And now, should we be content if and when Clinton's underlings in the State Department are stripped of their security clearances over this, when she has not been?
Or alternatively, should we be content if and when neither Clinton nor her underlings are stripped of their security clearances, since that would mean no consequences for any of them?
One of these two conundrums will most certainly arise--and for the express reason that Clinton has not suffered any consequences. What to do?
Doubt anyone here can answer
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
Doubt anyone here can answer those questions. Doubt the FBI or whoever won't share any details with you.
The devil is in the details.
(in reply to Tamara Shepherd)
From what we know via the "mainstream media" about these cases there are several clear distinctions.
First and foremost is that in the Nishimura and White cases they were operating under superior's orders and protocol in the Department of Defense. In Clinton's case she is the superior in charge of determining protocol in the Department of State.
The second distinction would be in the nature of the materials concerned. It is currently being reported that the two biggest items found in Clinton's servers were e-mails concerning the times of two upcoming meetings. Both military personel were in hard copy possession of plans/blueprints whose value was not subject to change relative to the immediate passing of time.
Nishimura and White were military and subject to military as well as civilian law. Clinton is a civilian.
The biggest distinction is whether or not the parties were following orders or giving orders. Comey made his point that, "We don't operate like that" as it related to Clinton's servers, yet, she was denied a secure phone when she requested it upon becoming Secretary of State. She had to do her job and she wasn't known for letting people stand in her way. Had someone not been messing with her to begin with and had her communication systems been handled properly by the folks that should have taken initiative to begin with, this situation would likely not have occured.
Based on what I know about how D.C. works (several relatives have or had clearances) it is a fair assumption that some of the nit-picky issues Clinton had with underlings were probably the subject of gossip in and around Capitol Hill and my guess is that Sanders stayed away from the issue because he thought Clinton was probably getting a raw deal. I suspect she was. She had a job to do, and, while I don't agree with everything she did, she was certainly competent as she showed by the fact that even her so-called unsecured servers were as far as anyone can figure, secure.
The standard of whether or not Clinton is being treated fairly is not to compare her to enlisted men and their protocol, but to compare her to other Secratarys of State and Cabinet members.
not the first time Comey has been soft on Clintons
(link...)!
In 2004, Comey, then serving as a deputy attorney general in the Justice Department, apparently limited the scope of the criminal investigation of Sandy Berger, which left out former Clinton administration officials who may have coordinated with Berger in his removal and destruction of classified records from the National Archives. The documents were relevant to accusations that the Clinton administration was negligent in the build-up to the 9/11 terrorist attack.