(It's curious that this doesn't get much play in the lefty blogosphere. Are we not supposed to be concerned about this? Seems like it could help Republicans more than Democrats this time around. On the other hand, the GOP has taken the art of attack ads to a new level and the Dems are still on training wheels. And I suppose the right-wing would like to make every House and Senate race about Hillary. I guess I didn't get the memo from Overlord Kos, so I don't know what the talking points are supposed to be. Either way, it seems unconstitutional to me.)
Submitted by Joe P. (not verified) on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 8:55am.
How is that this alters the landscape of secret candidate coordiantion and hidden campaign dollars funding broadcast commercials, such as those in use for several election cycles by the "527" groups?
I can see this limits how some groups and candidates can legally spend money on advertising, but does it limit the speech of news reports, editorials, bloggers, etc?
Submitted by SayUncle on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 11:59am.
Ah yes, the old 'I've-got-nothing-of-substance-to-add-to-the-discussion-so-I'll-rip-off-Eddie-Izzard-jokes-and-make-reference-to-naivete-in-a-political-ideology' gambit.
Submitted by SayUncle on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 12:13pm.
I just made a bag of popcorn and look forward to a good metulj vs. Uncle dog fight
Nah, no ripping. He'll just throw out lame non-sequiturs (see, he already started) and I'll be a smart ass. I'll eventually get bored and stop reading.
Anyhow, OB/GYNs are licensed. It is a fascinating concept applicable to cars, planes, home inspectors, drain line cleaners, dog groomers, hairstylists, and massage therapists but for some reason not applicable to people who own small contrivances whose primary purpose is to kill living beings. A license is a regulation, nicht wahr?
Please learn what non sequitur means. It applies to the person making a premise and then drawing a conclusion that does not follow. Your premise was on regulation. A license is a regulation. Pace.
OK. Back to bringing my old house's wiring back up to code. I'll have to get a licensed electrician to check behind me though.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Submitted by SayUncle on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 12:39pm.
Non sequitur has more meanings than the definition as it pertains to logic/philisophical hooey. I suggest you learn those other meanings. I guess you didn't since you brought up guns, again.
I'm aware that many jobs are regulated. But the right to speech, arms, and, well, those others enumerated in the constitution should not be regulated to the point of stifling those rights.
But isn't being a OB/GYN an expression of one's identity as a doctor? Isn't requiring licensure of OB/GYNs a limitation on that expression? Logical leap? No more so than whatever maudlin reason one can come up with to get pissed about a right no one has ever been able to come close to abridging in any meaningful way in over two hundred years. Think about this: What is not expressed has always been as meaningful as what is expressed. Wrap your mind around that and you'll make another leap: From the 18th Century to the 21st. Anyhow, philisophical aside (Could 'hooey' exist without thinking about it? Hrm), I'll stop playing this game if you will.
Also, non sequitur has only one meaning ("It does not follow"). Any other meaning has been laminated onto it by people who either didn't get it the first time or are just looking for a good word to use when all else fails, e.g. "Ronald Reagan was famous for his non sequiturs." Non sequitur does not mean 'incoherent' as there may be a context unknown to one or more of the respondents.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Submitted by SayUncle on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 1:09pm.
Logical leap?
More like a fallacy. Since you seem to be up on all that hooey, I figured you'd know that.
'No more so than whatever maudlin reason one can come up with to get pissed about a right no one has ever been able to come close to abridging in any meaningful way in over two hundred years. Think about this: What is not expressed has always been as meaningful as what is expressed. Wrap your mind around that and you'll make another leap: From the 18th Century to the 21st. Anyhow, philisophical aside (Could 'hooey' exist without thinking about it? Hrm), I'll stop playing this game if you will.
A non sequitur is a literary device; used in comedy (as opposed to its use in formal logic), it is a comment which, due to its lack of meaning relative to the comment it follows'
I suppose you'll tell me that 'bear' is only a four-legged, omnivourous critter and can't also mean 'support'?
But you are speaking differently when you are speaking in a literary sense. So if you are using non sequitur as a comedic device, I shouldn't take you seriously.
Your 'bear' example is a non starter. They are two different words. The etymology of 'bear (animal)' versus 'bear (verb)' is different. non sequitur means 'it does not follow.' 'Bear (verb)' comes from the Latin form ferre via Old English, if you ascribe to Verner's Law. 'Bear (animal)' derives from the Old English brun. The OED box set is a fun thing to have. Comes with a magnifying glass too.
As for logical fallacies, please demonstrate which one I am guilty of. I wait with bated breath.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Submitted by SayUncle on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 3:27pm.
But you are speaking differently when you are speaking in a literary sense.
I wasn't speaking, I was typing. Your comment was noted due to its lack of meaning relative to the comment it follows.
So if you are using non sequitur as a comedic device, I shouldn't take you seriously
You're the one that ripped off Izzard, not me. Hence, me not taking your initial comment seriously.
Your 'bear' example is a non starter.... with a magnifying glass too.
Zzzzzzz. Bear has more than one meaning as does non sequitur.
As for logical fallacies, please demonstrate which one I am guilty of
Your statement relied on its own presupposition (i.e., being a doctor is expression). I'm not up on all that hooey, but I think that's called circular logic or begging the question. I'm sure you, with your knowledge of the hooey, will set me straight or tell me that I can't read or something. The fact you qualified the statement with the phrase 'logical leap' implies that it's, err, quite a leap.
"But (you knew that was coming) have they ever seen something they don't want regulated by the .gov? I mean other than abortion."
I refer the gentleman to comments he made sometime ago. Were you being logical, comedic or both?
Actually my reference did not rely on its own presuppostion because one's occupation is an expression of one's self (whether you like it or not) and I qualified that as much.
Bear and 'to bear' are two different words. That's irrefutable. Your example is bad. Try again. In a logical argument, 'non sequitur' has a very specific meaning. Demonstrate otherwise. Your example was 'comedy.' I am not being funny. Yet. As for Eddie Izzard, if you are going to steal, steal from a fellow traveler. We share in common two things: Getting kicked out of the best schools money can buy and not letting it stop us.
Anyhow, you link 'abortion' to who knows what, because your political ideology is basically comprised of pablumesque snippets puked when you decide to burp and then accuse me of something that I wasn't doing, as defined. Physician, heal thyself....
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Submitted by SayUncle on Wed, 2006/09/06 - 4:58pm.
'I refer the gentleman to comments he made sometime ago. Were you being logical, comedic or both?'
And that has exactly what to do with the logical progression of our discussion? If you were referencing said comment, then I'd recommend quoting it.
'Actually my reference did not rely on its own presuppostion because one's occupation is an expression of one's self'
Then why did you use the question mark:
But isn't being a OB/GYN an expression of one's identity as a doctor?
Seems you were asking to me.
Bear and 'to bear' are two different words. That's irrefutable.
Yes. Bear can also be appropriately described as a word that has the same spelling as another. It's a homograph, iirc. If I write bear, you are left to determine based on its context whether I mean the animal or some other meaning. If I walked down the street yelling 'bear', you'd have no idea what i meant but i'd recommend you look around for the four-legged variety so as not to get your doritos stolen. Ditto for non sequitur. I meant non sequitur in the a reply that has no relevance to what preceded it. You know, those other definitions of a phrase/word may have that I've mentioned before. Or, if you like, two different phrases that happen to be spelled the same and have different meanings. It might even be a homograph too, were it not a phrase.
Demonstrate otherwise
I did. At least twice now.
Anyhow, you link 'abortion' to who knows what,
I chose abortion for a very specific and pointed reason. I don't think that reason is lost on you. And, of course, it was intended to be a bit humorous.
because your political ideology is basically comprised of pablumesque snippets puked when you decide to burp and then accuse me of something that I wasn't doing, as defined.
Pot, kettle.
Anyhoo, I tried to engage you. But you seem more content to throw around the hooey you must have learned on your high school debate team, or some such. And playing silly little semantic games, which I guess you learned from getting kicked out of school. So tiring and very little reward, other than watching you get your knickers in twist.
Calling me an ideologue is hilarious. I think that the idea of the idea was a bad idea. As for semantics, that's all anything is. If you can't get your mind around that, then you, well, are an ideologue. Everything is up to criticism.
Bear: In German, the word for bear is "Baer." The word for "to bear" is "tragen." "Die Baer trug einen Schuh." The bear bore a shoe. The same goes for English. The words are different words. You made a bad example.
As for my knickers: My blood pressure doesn't even flicker over this stuff. Now, get me on post-socialist real estate markets or developing world commodity chains and you might see me get red in the face.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
How is that this alters the landscape of secret candidate coordiantion and hidden campaign dollars funding broadcast commercials, such as those in use for several election cycles by the "527" groups?
I can see this limits how some groups and candidates can legally spend money on advertising, but does it limit the speech of news reports, editorials, bloggers, etc?
I'm curious about the left's reaction to it as well, and I applaud yours.
But (you knew that was coming) have they ever seen something they don't want regulated by the .gov? I mean other than abortion.
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
Ah yes, the 'I've-got-nothing-else-but-naive-libertarianism-so-Hillary-Clinton-wants-to-put-babies-on-spikes' gambit.
OB/GYNs are heavily regulated. Think about it.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Ah yes, the old 'I've-got-nothing-of-substance-to-add-to-the-discussion-so-I'll-rip-off-Eddie-Izzard-jokes-and-make-reference-to-naivete-in-a-political-ideology' gambit.
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
I just made a bag of popcorn and look forward to a good metulj vs. Uncle dog fight. Better than a movie and cheaper too.
Let it rip...
Nah, no ripping. He'll just throw out lame non-sequiturs (see, he already started) and I'll be a smart ass. I'll eventually get bored and stop reading.
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
I am already bored with it.
Anyhow, OB/GYNs are licensed. It is a fascinating concept applicable to cars, planes, home inspectors, drain line cleaners, dog groomers, hairstylists, and massage therapists but for some reason not applicable to people who own small contrivances whose primary purpose is to kill living beings. A license is a regulation, nicht wahr?
Please learn what non sequitur means. It applies to the person making a premise and then drawing a conclusion that does not follow. Your premise was on regulation. A license is a regulation. Pace.
OK. Back to bringing my old house's wiring back up to code. I'll have to get a licensed electrician to check behind me though.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Non sequitur has more meanings than the definition as it pertains to logic/philisophical hooey. I suggest you learn those other meanings. I guess you didn't since you brought up guns, again.
I'm aware that many jobs are regulated. But the right to speech, arms, and, well, those others enumerated in the constitution should not be regulated to the point of stifling those rights.
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
But isn't being a OB/GYN an expression of one's identity as a doctor? Isn't requiring licensure of OB/GYNs a limitation on that expression? Logical leap? No more so than whatever maudlin reason one can come up with to get pissed about a right no one has ever been able to come close to abridging in any meaningful way in over two hundred years. Think about this: What is not expressed has always been as meaningful as what is expressed. Wrap your mind around that and you'll make another leap: From the 18th Century to the 21st. Anyhow, philisophical aside (Could 'hooey' exist without thinking about it? Hrm), I'll stop playing this game if you will.
Also, non sequitur has only one meaning ("It does not follow"). Any other meaning has been laminated onto it by people who either didn't get it the first time or are just looking for a good word to use when all else fails, e.g. "Ronald Reagan was famous for his non sequiturs." Non sequitur does not mean 'incoherent' as there may be a context unknown to one or more of the respondents.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
But isn't being a OB/GYN an expression of one's identity as a doctor?
And their love with women, according to Bush.
More like a fallacy. Since you seem to be up on all that hooey, I figured you'd know that.
Zzzzzzzzzz
non sequitur also happens to mean:
I suppose you'll tell me that 'bear' is only a four-legged, omnivourous critter and can't also mean 'support'?
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
But you are speaking differently when you are speaking in a literary sense. So if you are using non sequitur as a comedic device, I shouldn't take you seriously.
Your 'bear' example is a non starter. They are two different words. The etymology of 'bear (animal)' versus 'bear (verb)' is different. non sequitur means 'it does not follow.' 'Bear (verb)' comes from the Latin form ferre via Old English, if you ascribe to Verner's Law. 'Bear (animal)' derives from the Old English brun. The OED box set is a fun thing to have. Comes with a magnifying glass too.
As for logical fallacies, please demonstrate which one I am guilty of. I wait with bated breath.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
I wasn't speaking, I was typing. Your comment was noted due to its lack of meaning relative to the comment it follows.
You're the one that ripped off Izzard, not me. Hence, me not taking your initial comment seriously.
Zzzzzzz. Bear has more than one meaning as does non sequitur.
Your statement relied on its own presupposition (i.e., being a doctor is expression). I'm not up on all that hooey, but I think that's called circular logic or begging the question. I'm sure you, with your knowledge of the hooey, will set me straight or tell me that I can't read or something. The fact you qualified the statement with the phrase 'logical leap' implies that it's, err, quite a leap.
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
"But (you knew that was coming) have they ever seen something they don't want regulated by the .gov? I mean other than abortion."
I refer the gentleman to comments he made sometime ago. Were you being logical, comedic or both?
Actually my reference did not rely on its own presuppostion because one's occupation is an expression of one's self (whether you like it or not) and I qualified that as much.
Bear and 'to bear' are two different words. That's irrefutable. Your example is bad. Try again. In a logical argument, 'non sequitur' has a very specific meaning. Demonstrate otherwise. Your example was 'comedy.' I am not being funny. Yet. As for Eddie Izzard, if you are going to steal, steal from a fellow traveler. We share in common two things: Getting kicked out of the best schools money can buy and not letting it stop us.
Anyhow, you link 'abortion' to who knows what, because your political ideology is basically comprised of pablumesque snippets puked when you decide to burp and then accuse me of something that I wasn't doing, as defined. Physician, heal thyself....
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
And that has exactly what to do with the logical progression of our discussion? If you were referencing said comment, then I'd recommend quoting it.
Then why did you use the question mark:
Seems you were asking to me.
Yes. Bear can also be appropriately described as a word that has the same spelling as another. It's a homograph, iirc. If I write bear, you are left to determine based on its context whether I mean the animal or some other meaning. If I walked down the street yelling 'bear', you'd have no idea what i meant but i'd recommend you look around for the four-legged variety so as not to get your doritos stolen. Ditto for non sequitur. I meant non sequitur in the a reply that has no relevance to what preceded it. You know, those other definitions of a phrase/word may have that I've mentioned before. Or, if you like, two different phrases that happen to be spelled the same and have different meanings. It might even be a homograph too, were it not a phrase.
I did. At least twice now.
I chose abortion for a very specific and pointed reason. I don't think that reason is lost on you. And, of course, it was intended to be a bit humorous.
Pot, kettle.
Anyhoo, I tried to engage you. But you seem more content to throw around the hooey you must have learned on your high school debate team, or some such. And playing silly little semantic games, which I guess you learned from getting kicked out of school. So tiring and very little reward, other than watching you get your knickers in twist.
---
SayUncle
Can't we all just get a long gun?
"Pot, kettle"
Calling me an ideologue is hilarious. I think that the idea of the idea was a bad idea. As for semantics, that's all anything is. If you can't get your mind around that, then you, well, are an ideologue. Everything is up to criticism.
Bear: In German, the word for bear is "Baer." The word for "to bear" is "tragen." "Die Baer trug einen Schuh." The bear bore a shoe. The same goes for English. The words are different words. You made a bad example.
As for my knickers: My blood pressure doesn't even flicker over this stuff. Now, get me on post-socialist real estate markets or developing world commodity chains and you might see me get red in the face.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
"I just made a bag of popcorn and look forward to a good metulj vs. Uncle dog fight. Better than a movie and cheaper too.
Let it rip..."
Number9,
You must be prophetic, hope you made a big bag of popcorn!
(In William Shatner Star Trek voice)
Can't understand.....only have bachelor of science degree....PhD words too big....nerd alert....nerd alert....Kaaaaahn!
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