Tue
Jun 15 2010
09:19 pm
By: rikki
City Council unanimously approved hens in the city on first reading. Well done, ladies and gentlemen. Special thanks to Councilman Woodhull for sponsoring the resolution and to Pavlis for a thoughtful and heartfelt explanation of his support. Time to start forming egg-sharing coalitions, neighborhoods, then show up for second reading to say how excited you are to get started.
I watched on cable and heard a remark off-camera about "the PETA uproar" that will come if Knoxville requires wing clipping. Does anyone who know who said that? Someone needs to be informed that wing clipping involves snipping the tips from flight feathers and not lopping off the entire wing! Unless you cut too close to the base of the feather, the chicken won't even feel pain.
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I thought it was the Mayor,
I thought it was the Mayor, but I'm not sure.
They were all getting a bit silly by the end of the discussion.
Yeah, it was Haslam.
Yeah, it was Haslam.
It was someone on Council
It was someone on Council who made that remark sometime around when all the puns and joking started up. It was a good discussion, with reasoned, respectful, substantive comments and arguments from Council and from those those who came to speak to the issue from the floor.
Flashback: Knoxville City
Flashback:
Knoxville City Council First District Candidate Q&A:
Pavlis admitted tonight that
Pavlis admitted tonight that he "snickered" at this at first, but then realized it was serious. Good for him.
As god is my witness
...I thought chickens could fly.
That turkey line is one of
That turkey line is one of the funniest lines in all of television sitcom history.
Clipping wings is little more
Clipping wings is little more than trimming hooves or fingernails. Doesn't go to the quick. It just keeps chickens from being able to fly any better than they can, which isn't very well.
Council also unanimously
Council also unanimously approved the use of goats for kudzu eradication, but that's a city program, not private goat ownership.
They are impossible to keep
That could easily be the quote of the day.
My aunt had a goat as a pet on their big dairy farm in Morgan County. I remember arriving there once when I was a child and seeing aunt Ruby's goat standing on top of their early 50s Chevrolet sedanette.
FAQs from Seattle re chickens
FAQs from Seattle re chickens in the city.
I would suggest getting a goose to go with them.
Don't think the ordinance allows for geese, only female chickens.
Other thoughts on restrictions:
Must be kept a certain distance from a neighbors yard.
What about slaughtering the chickens?
What if a neighbor decides the chickens are a nuisance?
No slaughtering allowed under
No slaughtering allowed under the ordinance.
And as long as the chicken owner's in compliance with the ordinance, it doesn't matter what the neighbor thinks.
At one point during the meeting, someone (I forget who, but it may have been Brenda Palmer, who appears to be the most anti-chicken member) said they'd gotten a complaint from a constituent who said they woke up to find their neighbor's hen standing on their back deck.
Oh, the horror!
She also said she heard from someone who said they had to sell their house and move away because their neighbor got chickens.
No slaughtering allowed under
No slaughtering allowed under the ordinance.
Oops, I missed that in my first scan of the document.
What are you supposed to do,
What are you supposed to do, keep them until they die of old age? Hens will stop being productive layers well before they die of natural causes.
I wondered that myself. The
I wondered that myself.
You can have up to 6 chickens on a 5000 sq ft lot (just over 1/10 of an acre). Thus, you could end up having approx. 60 chickens on an acre of land that is subdivided into 10 lots. This is a limit whether it is single unit or multi-family housing.
The first year you may lots of eggs (180 – 320 eggs per year for their first year of laying), then who knows. Since you can't sell the eggs, I suppose you must eat a lot of eggs or be giving a lot away. The ordinance says, "Hens shall be kept as pets and for personal use only; no person shall sell eggs or engage in chicken breeding or fertilizer production for commercial purposes." Hmmm, I wonder if bartering with excess eggs is considered selling the eggs.
Since the chickens must be kept in a completely enclosed area or have the wings clipped when in an uncovered fenced area, I would think you will not see one on any back porch.
I wonder how hard it will be to get the $50 penalty assessed when the law is ignored.
RE: Must be kept a certain distance from a neighbors yard.
Oops, missed another one. This is also already included in the ordinance. It appears, everything related to the chickens must be at least 10 feet from the property line.
I mentioned this to my wife
I mentioned this to my wife who said who pointed out you could just take them outside the city limits if you wanted them butchered. She has a friend who lives in Knox County that raises chicken for meat and eggs. Others take chickens to her when they don't have the heart or know-how.
The egg production drop-off is true. We have 10 chickens that are 16 months old. We have only had 3 to 5 eggs per day for the last several weeks, down from 8 to 10 last spring. I'm sure the heat has something to do with it. Plus we have two that have gone "broody".
they woke up to find their
they woke up to find their neighbor's hen standing on their back deck.
Oh, the horror!
I thought that was funny enough to repeat to the spouse when he got home from his bike class (he's now teaching one non-credit at UT).
I woke up one morning to find a skunk on my patio - that was considerably more bothersome than a chicken, and we managed to survive.
PETA Remark
I can say with almost certainty that the remark was made by Councilman Della Volpe. Our time campaigning together has imprinted his voice in my head forever. Nick is the king of one liners and this ordinance was ripe for the picking.
Ray Abbas
Nope, the remark (by
Nope, the remark (by whomever) was made TO Della Volpe, in response to something he said.
No, it was made TO Charles
No, it was made TO Charles Swanson when he remarked that the ordinance had "anticipated every possibility," to which someone asked, "Did it anticipate the outrage from PETA?"
I'm going to take the judgment of someone who was there over those watching it on TV, and I believe agrarianurbanite was there and the rest of us watched from home. Also, Haslam had just arrived and was still feeling out the discussion, so it seems unlikely he would blurt out something like that. Della Volpe said several things that made me think chickens and gardens and such are outside his experience.
Oh, you're right. It WAS
Oh, you're right. It WAS made to Swanson. I guess I got confused because he sits next to Della Volpe.
But I could have sworn that remark came somewhere from the Mayor's right.
Oh well.
Della Volpe
I'm pretty sure it was Della Volpe in response to the attorney who was reading the ordinance and clarifying the issue of wing clipping. Della Volpe seems to have a knack for talking out.
His Chinese food statement was rather distasteful.
Would neighborhood covenants
Would neighborhood covenants that do not allow chickens still have priority? Could neighborhoods add to the convenants to not allow chickens?
I'm not a lawyer, but I
I'm not a lawyer, but I suspect that subdivision covenants are a layer on top of city ordinances, so that yes, a subdivision with such covenants could prohibit chickens.
Anybody know for sure?
My neighborhood association
My neighborhood association sent around a flier reminding everybody that our covenant specifically forbids the keeping of poultry or livestock. I personally have no desire to have a bunch of nasty chickens running around in my yard, but it might be worth doing to see if my Neighborhood Association took me to Chancery Court for an injunction. The Case of the Suburban Anti-Chicken Covenant: that would make some chancellor's day.
Yes
Yes, neighborhoods with homeowner associations (not neighborhood associations community organizations)can create a covenant making chickens illegal overriding the ordinance in their particular neighborhood. It will depend on how the majority of people in that neighborhood feel about chickens. If it is a neighborhood that doesn't allow you to hang your laundry outside to dry, forbids compost bins or a vegetable garden, chances don't look good.
What we need are some
What we need are some regulations that would help us get rid of some of our neighbors.
Plus we have two that have
Plus we have two that have gone "broody".
Had to look that one up, don't know "broody".
How to stop a broody hen from staying broody.
interesting
hormones?
We used to call them "settin' hens" I never knew about the downside to being all broody. All our chickens were free-range and the only predators we had were daddy's huntin' dogs who took a liking to eggs. If momma found a dog with egg on their face, she would get her 22ga and take 'em out.
If Tennessee is a "Right To
If Tennessee is a "Right To Farm State" TCA 43-26-103. Does the city have the legal authority to restrict chickens? I don't know?
The proposed ordinance is
The proposed ordinance is getting a more indepth look. This is the second time they have put off voting. It appears Woodhull is trying to get more input from neighborhoods. I hope it is all neighborhoods in the city, not just the ones contacting them, or it could later become a problem like the TYP has.
He said that because of
He said that because of summer travel schedules he is having trouble getting all the stakeholders together.