If they dare to come out in the open field and defend the gold standard as a good thing, we shall fight them to the uttermost, having behind us the producing masses of the nation and the world. Having behind us the commercial interests and the laboring interests and all the toiling masses, we shall answer their demands for a gold standard by saying to them, you shall not press down upon the brow of labor this crown of thorns. You shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold. -- William Jennings Bryan
Barack Obama was the main attraction up the street at Saint Peter's College today. I planned on attending but it conflicted with pre-arranged activities for the kids and, frankly, I'd rather assent to my daughters' wishes and potential hissy fits than listen to a stump speech. Oh, I am sure that Obama can deliver a humdinger, but I'd really rather not. So, I decided to take another approach in getting a feel for the crowd and what was going on. This AM I had a series of meetings on some research work I am doing and a meeting with my co-teacher (I'm a "mentor" grad instructor now) in Manhattan. I came back at 130PM on the PATH train to Journal Square with the throng headed from the City to Not-The-City to hear him speak. Here's what I found out/discovered about the folks who want to hear what Obama has to say or are, in some cases, hard on the side of the man from Illinois.
I got off at the appropriate stop (Journal Square) and the pack cars emptied out with hundreds of mystified New Yorks blinking at the clean, modern train station lacking dripping pipes and gargantuan rats that give their MTA platforms such credibility and charm. Up the escalator and out on the plaza, the throng stopped all together as if to ask, "Umm, where now?" Journal Square isn't exactly a tony spot, but we are getting a new twin tower development that will probably see the end of the panhandlers and junk sellers that are part of the tapestry that is my end of town.
I started walking quickly to get on the way down John F. Kennedy Blvd to Saint Peter's and this seemed to tip off that I knew where I was going and several people fell in with me. A black woman with a NYU sweatshirt asked me if I knew where the Obama event was and I said I was headed that way. "Great. Are you going?" I told her I couldn't because of the end of the school day. She was astonished that I lived in Jersey City. I told her about my love of underdog places and she laughed. This trip for a lot of these Manhattanites was like going to the moon. I asked her if I could blog about the experience of walking with the crowd and my talk with her and she assented.
What's got you jazzed about Obama? She immediately pointed to his ability to make people hopeful and his "record." I asked her if hope was important right now. She said that the last 7 years was like being held captive by aliens. I had to laugh as this is a typical way of thinking among NYers when it comes to political power outside the city. They can suffer Giuliani as mayor, but when it comes to the same guy acting the ass from Washington, they'll have none of it, thank you. Again: But you are hopeful when you hear Obama and his rather limited platform? Yes. I know he hasn't articulated a lot, she said, but I know he's got a great base for his ideas and speaks really well. So, I asked, do you think that a great campaigner makes a great president? No, she answered, that was self-evident with Bush.
A young couple joined us as we crossed over into the McGinley Square neighborhood and they were headed to the Obama rally as well. One woman offered without prompting that she was suffering this trip as she would feel stupid to have not heard Obama in person even though she is voting for Clinton. Now that would normally sound noble to me, but I wanted to know what she thought about Clinton's dubious record on the war, the economy and her insistence on keeping the health insurers in on health care reform. Well, she voted on the knowledge she had been given on the war. OK. But that's specious as her job as a Senator is oversight of the executive branch. Do you think she did that well? There was a rush to war, but everyone was afraid of another attack. Oh. Boy. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, right? Oh, yeah. I know that. I just meant the general mood of the country was that. OK. What about the economy? What does she have to offer? What would she do differently? Anything is better than what is happening now. It is just like Bush is fiddling while Rome burns. She'd act somehow. Not sure how, but she would. Just like she did on health care in the early 90s? That sucked. The GOP just screamed like babies about socialism and whatever. It wasn't. No. It wasn't even close. And to think that a person who has enormous corporate backing could be a socialist... She scowled. Well, whatever money it is, it is better than oil money. So if Obama were to impress you, would you switch your vote? No. Though it might make her mad [pointing at her partner].
So you are for Obama? Yeah. I am sick of the Clinton/Bush axis. There's no difference. At least this guy is attempting to have a different message. But what is that message? Peace? Hope?
We walked up to the college and I bid them goodbye as I had to cross the street to go to my girls' school on the other side of Saint Peter's campus. I asked the couple if I could blog about our talk and the Clinton supporter said, "I sure am." She smiled and we parted. It's one of those Northeast moments. You spend a little time away with a person then you never see them again. My thoughts as I walked across the Boulevard went back to the "Peace and Hope" theme. Is Obama some sort of secular messianic figure for voters fed up with cynicism? Does he need any other message?
I joked yesterday that I will be pulling the lever for Obama if only to propel him to the candidacy in order to expose the media for what it is (incompetent and shiftless) and to expose the GOP for what they are: exclusivists and anti-democrats. I don't like the blindness to Clinton's chameleon-like prowess and I don't like the Obama brimstone preacher masquerade that offers few answers, but plenty of searing sermons. He doesn't evoke JFK, whose eponymous street I walked down today so much as he channels Bryan to his own ends.
Submitted by Carole Borges on Wed, 2008/01/09 - 11:45pm.
Watch for Barak Obama to begin to lead voters to a more careful examination of how "exerienced" Hillary and Bill are at maintaining the status quo in Washington. If we don't know anything else, we know that's not what the majority of Americans want.
The president usually relies on advisors to a large extent. Obama's exceptionally smart, and he also seems to value integrity, so he should be able to create a staff and cabinet of exceptional people with real expertise and vision, rather than the entrenched politicos and lobbyists that will undoubtedly surround the Clintons.
I think Obama really does represent a more evolved desire to serve all the people, and that time will reveal that he does have sufficient knowledge and substance to bring to the White House.
The fact that one Obama staffer used to be a lobbyist is a weak attack coming from the Clintons. They are both up to their hips in special interests. I'm not one of those people that hate Hillary. Actually I have over the years admired her toughness, but there's no doubt in my mind she is a practiced Washington "player".
Any Democrat in the race would, of course, be far better than any of the Republican possibilities who were all recently heard on the last debate openly boasting about what a terrific president George W. Bush has been. Yuk! Pass the Kool-Aid please.
I think history will prove Barack Obama to be a monumental figure in American history. I think he will be the next president.
Anyone with the sense to surround themselves with good people can be a good President. A decider is only as good as his rationale; honest advisors breed honest policy.
I knew Bush was more than just a lesser evil when he appointed Rumsfeld, Ashcroft and the worst of his Daddy's leftovers, but we all should have seen that coming after Cheney appointed himself VP. For eight years America has been ruled by a tiny cadre of war profiteers riding to riches on dishonesty.
We need a President who is an independent on Iraq, unsure whether to stay or go. We need thoughtful representatives willing to learn and deliberate. We do not need partisans dedicated to a side; we need competence ready to decide. We need to let adults run the country for a little while. Both parties have given us adults to choose from, though anyone still willing to declare themselves a Republican needs to be looked at sideways.
As of January 2008, I would still rather have impeachment underway than trust Bushco with another day of power. In December 2008 I will feel the same way. Impeachment for simple dereliction of duty was appropriate on Sept. 12, 2001 and has only grown more urgent since. If Dick Cheney leaves office without coming under Congressional investigation, my country has lost its way.
I guess the point is that there isn't anything to ask Obama folks. They are starry-eyed. Clinton on the other had has things that can be asked about her. I am not a "for Clinton" person, but that's only because you can scratch and sniff with her and I think she stinks. Obama on the other hand has this following that doesn't scratch. They believe they don't have to.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Submitted by Andy Axel on Thu, 2008/01/10 - 11:07am.
Well, whatever money it is, it is better than oil money.
Big insurance money or pharma money or airline industry money or coal money or agribusiness money or gun money or military contractor money or telco money ... [insert appropriate Pink Floyd bass riff here]
At least this guy is attempting to have a different message.
I'm a little more concerned with policy rather than message, but that's not "the world in which we're living."*
Is this a direct quote? Was the phrase "attempting" to have a different message? Pretty telling.
In that link you posted to the video the other day, The Big Dog had a point which is quickly lost upon Obama's cadre: Obama and Clinton indeed had a virtually indistinguishable voting record in the Senate. The central message of Obama on Iraq is irrelevant, as he wasn't even in the Senate when the enabling resolutions came up. It's easy to be on record as against the war when you didn't hold office at the time. Ask Dodd and Edwards and Biden. Ask Obama's collleague Dick Durbin.
I'm not high on the electability standard after the establishment (TM) handed us Kerry last time with a host of promises about how he was a "fighter." I'm not high on third parties after "the shipwreck strategem" helped give a hand up to Bush; if it was indeed a goal of the movement to show the country just how bad things could be, mission &c.
I admit it, I love hearing the guy talk. By the same token, I like Frank Capra's sunny idealism, too.
But speaking in the scratch & sniff metaphor, on matters of policy for which he's actually been accounted for in roll call votes, he's redolent of milk & toast.
* the actual phrase from "Live & Let Die," one of solo McCartney's best outings, despite being a Bond commission. It's oft misquoted as "the world in which we live in."
____________________________
With the possible exception of things like box scores, race results, and stock market tabulations, there is no such thing as Objective Journalism. The phrase itself is a pompous contradiction in terms.
The lesser of two evils and all that...
Watch for Barak Obama to begin to lead voters to a more careful examination of how "exerienced" Hillary and Bill are at maintaining the status quo in Washington. If we don't know anything else, we know that's not what the majority of Americans want.
The president usually relies on advisors to a large extent. Obama's exceptionally smart, and he also seems to value integrity, so he should be able to create a staff and cabinet of exceptional people with real expertise and vision, rather than the entrenched politicos and lobbyists that will undoubtedly surround the Clintons.
I think Obama really does represent a more evolved desire to serve all the people, and that time will reveal that he does have sufficient knowledge and substance to bring to the White House.
The fact that one Obama staffer used to be a lobbyist is a weak attack coming from the Clintons. They are both up to their hips in special interests. I'm not one of those people that hate Hillary. Actually I have over the years admired her toughness, but there's no doubt in my mind she is a practiced Washington "player".
Any Democrat in the race would, of course, be far better than any of the Republican possibilities who were all recently heard on the last debate openly boasting about what a terrific president George W. Bush has been. Yuk! Pass the Kool-Aid please.
I think history will prove Barack Obama to be a monumental figure in American history. I think he will be the next president.
Anyone with the sense to surround themselves with good people can be a good President. A decider is only as good as his rationale; honest advisors breed honest policy.
I knew Bush was more than just a lesser evil when he appointed Rumsfeld, Ashcroft and the worst of his Daddy's leftovers, but we all should have seen that coming after Cheney appointed himself VP. For eight years America has been ruled by a tiny cadre of war profiteers riding to riches on dishonesty.
We need a President who is an independent on Iraq, unsure whether to stay or go. We need thoughtful representatives willing to learn and deliberate. We do not need partisans dedicated to a side; we need competence ready to decide. We need to let adults run the country for a little while. Both parties have given us adults to choose from, though anyone still willing to declare themselves a Republican needs to be looked at sideways.
As of January 2008, I would still rather have impeachment underway than trust Bushco with another day of power. In December 2008 I will feel the same way. Impeachment for simple dereliction of duty was appropriate on Sept. 12, 2001 and has only grown more urgent since. If Dick Cheney leaves office without coming under Congressional investigation, my country has lost its way.
Great write-up/report. I always enjoy man-on-the-street reporting.
It seems your questions were tougher for the Clinton supporter than the Obama supporter. Am I wrong?
I guess the point is that there isn't anything to ask Obama folks. They are starry-eyed. Clinton on the other had has things that can be asked about her. I am not a "for Clinton" person, but that's only because you can scratch and sniff with her and I think she stinks. Obama on the other hand has this following that doesn't scratch. They believe they don't have to.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
Big insurance money or pharma money or airline industry money or coal money or agribusiness money or gun money or military contractor money or telco money ... [insert appropriate Pink Floyd bass riff here]
I'm a little more concerned with policy rather than message, but that's not "the world in which we're living."*
Is this a direct quote? Was the phrase "attempting" to have a different message? Pretty telling.
In that link you posted to the video the other day, The Big Dog had a point which is quickly lost upon Obama's cadre: Obama and Clinton indeed had a virtually indistinguishable voting record in the Senate. The central message of Obama on Iraq is irrelevant, as he wasn't even in the Senate when the enabling resolutions came up. It's easy to be on record as against the war when you didn't hold office at the time. Ask Dodd and Edwards and Biden. Ask Obama's collleague Dick Durbin.
I'm not high on the electability standard after the establishment (TM) handed us Kerry last time with a host of promises about how he was a "fighter." I'm not high on third parties after "the shipwreck strategem" helped give a hand up to Bush; if it was indeed a goal of the movement to show the country just how bad things could be, mission &c.
I admit it, I love hearing the guy talk. By the same token, I like Frank Capra's sunny idealism, too.
But speaking in the scratch & sniff metaphor, on matters of policy for which he's actually been accounted for in roll call votes, he's redolent of milk & toast.
* the actual phrase from "Live & Let Die," one of solo McCartney's best outings, despite being a Bond commission. It's oft misquoted as "the world in which we live in."
____________________________
With the possible exception of things like box scores, race results, and stock market tabulations, there is no such thing as Objective Journalism. The phrase itself is a pompous contradiction in terms.
I enjoyed reading this post
He came outside and spoke over a bullhorn to the gathered mass outside the assembly hall.
True happiness is knowing you are a hypocrite. -- Ivor Cutler
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