Submitted by metulj on Thu, 2009/10/22 - 8:32pm

For those of the "Libertarian" bent who claim that no "Liberal" can actually care about freedom, I offer:



continued...

Chairman: "Mr. Grayson is recognized."
Grayson: "Thank you. I'd like to ask the gentleman from Georgia a few questions, and I'll yield to him for the purpose of having answers to these questions. Um, Does the gentleman from Georgia know what a bill of Attainder is?"

Broun (R-GA) "A bill of, the answer's yes, in fact it's been very explicitly described by the courts."
Grayson: "What is it?"
Looooooooooooooong pause while Broun looks through notes for an answer
Broun: "The courts have applied a two-pronged test. Number one, whether specific individuals or entities are affected by the statute, Number two, when the legislation affects a quote "punishment" end quote, on those individuals, it serves no legitimate regulatory purpose. "
Grayson: "What, um, does the Constitution says about Bills of Attainder?"
Broun: "Oh, I suggest that this is not a Bill of Attainder. It's, um, certainly does focus on a specific entity, but it does not inflict punishment by any means. In fact. . . "
Grayson: "Will the gentleman from Georgia explain what the Constitution says about Bills of Attainder?"
Outside Voice/another Republican: "Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield for a second? The gentleman from Florida?"
Grayson: "No. I'd like an answer to my question."
Outside Voice/another Republican: "Well, frankly, I can't wait to see the discussion when it comes to . . . . "
Grayson: "I did NOT yield, and I'd like an answer fron the gentleman from Georgia to my question, I. . ."
Chairman: "Li, Li, Listen, let's get back to all the time, is Mister, the gentleman from Florida, who will yield to the gentleman from Georgia, will . . ."
Grayson: "Right. What does the Constitution say about Bills of Attainder? It's a simple question."
Broun: "The Constitution says "Congress shall pass no Bills of Attainder" but this is not one . . . "
Grayson: "Alright, now, would you agree with me that it is Unconstitutional to single out one or more persons without the benefit of trial?"
Broun: "Uh, no sir, there is a two pronged test, this is not a Bill of Attainder, it is . . . "
Grayson: "Alright, well, when I, when I said, I'll reclaim my time. I just quoted William Rehnquist writing the book "The Supreme Court", he wrote that book and said "You can not single out on or more persons without the benefit of a trial." Will the gentleman agree that Bills of Attainder are contrary to every principle of sound legislation?"
Broun: "The two main criteria which courts would like to look, in order to determine whether legislation is a Bill of Attainder, one is whether a specific individual/entity is affected by extension, number two, whether the legislation affects a punishment to the individuals . . . "
Grayson: "Will the gentleman please tell me whether you agree or not that Bills of Attainder are contrary to every principle of sound legislation?"
Broun: "Bills of Attainder are Unconstitutional."
Grayson: "AND contrary to every principle of sound legislation, is that correct?"
Broun: "That's correct."
Grayson: "Alright. And you know who said that?"
Broun: "Tell me."
Grayson: "James Madison in the Federalist papers."
"Now, do you, does the gentleman agree that the Bill of Attainder clause was intended not as a narrow or technical provision, but rather as an implementation of the separation of powers, and a general safeguard against legislative exercise of the judicial function, or more simply, trial by legislation. Will the gentleman agree with me on that."
Outside Republican: "Will the Gentleman yield?"
Grayson: "No."
Laughter throughout the committee room , then silence. . .
Outside Representative: "Um, the, the, will the gentleman restate the question?"
Grayson: "The question is, will the gentleman from Georgia agree with me that the Bill of Attainder clause was intended not as a narrow or technical provision, but rather as an implementation of the separation of powers, and a general safeguard against legislative exercise of the judicial function, or more simply, trial by legislation. Will the gentleman agree to that?"
Broun: "No, sir, I will not, and I ask counsel to help us with this, I think all this is determination of the court and I'd like to appeal to Mr. Sensenberner (wingnut who's name I refuse to spell correctly)
Grayson: "Well, I'm sorry, but it's my time, not yours or Mr. Sensenberner's, so I will reclaim my time, and I will point out that what you just you would NOT agree to is from a Supreme Court case called the United States V Brown, something I would expect you might know about, given your name."
Outside voice: "Will the gentleman yield?"
Grayson: "No."
One voice laughs
Grayson: "Uh, listen, we, we are trampling on people's Constitutional rights. And I think it's unfortunate that the mania that exists on the other side of the aisle regarding this one organization, and we know why that mania exists, it's because they've registered an awful lot of Democrats, continues to distort and waste the time of this committee and many other committees here in Congress. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! I yield my remaining 5 seconds

To quote Rorty: "Take care of freedom and the truth will take care of itself."

67
vote
Andy Axel's picture

Just been watching Grayson

Just been watching Grayson in other discussions. Says he's a "Huey Long Democrat" - "Put the jam on the bottom shelf where even the little guy can reach it."

The amendment in question seeks to ensure that no money gets to ACORN, even though the bill doesn't give money to ACORN. But then, Republicans don't mind wasting all of our time on such frivolity. The GOP doesn't govern. It obstructs.

____________________________

Calling to the underworld. Come out of the cupboard, you boys and girls.

BrianPaone's picture

ACORN's lost its way

ACORN started out as a grassroots, low-income family advocacy group, but now seems to have a multi-corporate thumb in all kinds of pies - especially those with political flavors. This is what happens when a grassroots group gets full of itself and starts getting way too fancy with its actions.

ACORN would do well to go back to its roots, starting with dropping its PAC activities. If ACORN spends less time in Washington, that's more time it can be spending on the streets and in the neighborhoods where they're needed most.

As far as Republican bitching about ACORN's decidedly Democratic leanings, I fail to see how what the Dems did with ACORN is any different than what Repubs did with faith-based organizations, especially under Dubya.

In both cases, politics corrupted some well-meaning people and groups.

***

ANONYTARD (n.): A user of internet message boards who makes cowardly, baseless, and/or otherwise dishonorable attacks from an anonymous standpoint, with the express purpose of avoiding personal consequence via identification. Usually a virgin. Almost always a person with the social IQ of a decorative autumn squash.

gonzone's picture

heh

I love this guy.

He's smart, articulate, and has a spine.
He puts fear in the hearts of the opposition.
More like this please.
Hear me out there politicians?

Grayson really knows how to handle these "school yard bullies."

"If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?"

Virgil Proudfoot's picture

What I like about the guy

What I like most about Grayson is that he looks like he's having fun while telling the truth and giving the Repubs what they deserve. The guy's smart as a whip and, as far as I can tell, completely ethical. It'll be interesting to see what the Rs try to do to unseat him.

Check out his entirely appropriate response to Lord Cheney:
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/10/grayson-cheney-has-blood-that...

"I used to be with it, but then they changed what it was. Now what I'm with isn't it, and what's it seems scary and weird. It'll happen to you."
—Abraham Simpson

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