What: TYP public meeting re. mental health services
When: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 6:00pm
Where: Cansler Family YMCA, 616 Jessamine Street
City of Knoxville press release...
The Office of the Ten-Year Plan to End Chronic Homelessness would like to invite the public to a public conversation at the Cansler Family YMCA. The topic will be mental healthcare services in the context of permanent supportive housing. Sheryl McCormick, Coordinator, Recovery Training Services at Peninsula, will present for the first half-hour with Q & A to follow.
This is the fourth in a series of similar public conversations.
We would like to keep these meetings concise to respect the time of attendees. We will offer them on a regular basis, and invite presenters who can speak to their areas of expertise and to the roles that they play in support of the TYP. We’ll open up the floor for questions and conversation on the specific issue being addressed, and we’ll ask attendees for ideas about subjects they’d like for us to address in future public conversations. Comprehensive notes from all public conversations like this one are posted at http://tenyearplan.org.
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http://www.typchoice.com/
http://www.typchoice.com/
Thank you for the link, Mr. Peasote.
"There's still more."
Is the issue Monty Python or
Is the issue Monty Python or is the issue the Ten Year Plan?
Keep trying though.
Legitimize your opposition
Legitimize your opposition with openness. Using loopholes to conceal your sponsors is corrupt.
Yes, please.
From Randy's TYP link (Weekly Update 7-6-2010):
I'd like to cast one or more votes in favor of TYP's addressing this topic at the upcoming August conversation.
How TYP will deliver substance addiction treatment appears to be the single most concerning aspect of the Plan among neighborhoods to potentially receive PSH, so please provide us more details? Thanks.
David Arning/SHFand the Flenniken Project Must go Back to MPC
I watched Tuesday’s, City Council meeting last night on my Tivo, and saw a story that has gone completely un-reported in the Media.
David Arning, from Southeastern Housing Foundation, while formally withdrawing his Variance request for the Flenniken School project. Announced that the Metro Planning Commission has determined that Southeastern Housing Foundation must re-do the Use-on-Review approval that was granted to him by City Council last August in a 5-4 Vote that overturned the original MPC Denial. Now that he will build the 58 spaces required by Zoning for the site, he has to alter his site plan, and go back to MPC.
He said that he has re-filed his application, and the case will go before Metro Planning Commission on August 12th. He also said that he expected that the issue would be back before Council in September.
Like the June 11th, 2009 meeting of MPC, in which Mr. Arning presented the first Use-on-Review request for Flenniken, Mr. Arning must believe that once again, MPC will determine by Majority Vote that the Use-on-Review does not meet the usage allowed for the site. The Vote at MPC last year was 12-1 to deny his Use-on-Review request.
Arning must believe that the City Council will, once again over turn MPC’s Denial of his UOR Request. Considering the change in Council members since last June, I wonder if this will be the case.
The residents on the Southside that have been fighting this development for over two years, appears to have gained some real momentum, considering Local Powerhouse Attorney John King is now on their side.
This may have gone unreported
This may have gone unreported in the "media", but not here. I posted sometime last week that I had found out the UOR had to go back to MPC.
BTW, back to my usual type of question, but who's paying John King's salary? He said he was respresenting the south Knoxville residents, but Ron Peabody's signature was on the appeal form. So who's paying John King?
Rachel, What I said was: I
Rachel,
What I said was:
So you are correct, I should have said that you said they would have to go back to MPC and do the UOR again, on this blog site a week or so ago. Sorry about that.
What I meant to say was that since the meeting on Tuesday night it had gone completely Un-reported in the media.
As for the who is paying for John King thing, you should probably ask him.
As for the who is paying for
And he wouldn't tell you because....
On the TYP Website, the July 13th weekly update states:
This was just posted on the KNS article about the Sheriff's office, transporting Homeless from other counties to KARM:
http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2010/jul/14/homeless-transfers-end/
I have to wonder how much bang for the Buck the TYP is getting from Ackermann.
We have to wonder who you are
We have to wonder who you are working for, who are the people who are behind the anti-TYP "movement" and funding it, and who you are. So join the wonder club. I wonder which PR firm you work for. Hrm....
Don't see any deception, personally...
The way I read that July 13 TYP weekly update, whooshe, is that TYP abandoned the Lakeshore thought (sometime after that February City Council workshop) just like they abandoned the Teaberry Lane thought.
Personally, I don't see any deception in that action, just a change of plans.
As for the July 9 KNS story, it may be that TYP failed to inform KNS that Lakeshore was no longer under consideration, or it may be that KNS just chose to aggitate a bit on the Lakeshore possibility because it is/was a contentious issue that sells newspapers?
Have I missed something?
clarification
Tamara,
Jon Lawler told our reporter that there are no current plans for a PSH facility in Lakeshore Park. He went on to say, however, that it's possible that Lakeshore Park would be considered in 2011. Here's a link to the article: http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2010/jul/09/ashe-against-park-idea/
Scott Barker
KNS
TYP website post is last word, I guess?
Thanks, Scott--I hadn't looked back at that July 9 news story.
Is it just me, or is Lawler's comment there a bit garbled as to future and past and present tenses:
So Rebecca heard him say TYP's still considering Lakeshore for 2011, I guess, but TYP's July 13 weekly update, which followed her news story, is pretty emphatic that they're NOT considering it now or for 2011?
Dunno whether Rebecca possibly misunderstood or whether Lawler was alone in his continued interest in Lakeshore (and had to be "reeled in" by the board), but I suppose we confused on-lookers should rely on TYP's more recent website post as the last word?
The Funding cycle starts at
The Funding cycle starts at the first of the year, so 2012 looks good for Lakeshore.
Tamara, Dunno whether Rebecca
Tamara,
The Board has NO authority over the actions of Jon Lawler. They are an "advise and consent Board", nothing more.
As for the rest, this is standard Lawler double Talk. Don't say what you mean, say what they want to hear.
What does "but we are not there now" mean? I think it means. "let me say something that sounds like we are not going to do it", but means, "we are not going to say we are going to do it now, because of all the heat we are taking so it sounds good in the press, but we will do it according to schedule".
Resist. Urge. To. Post.
Resist. Urge. To. Post. Definition. Of. "Consent."
Deflect, attack, ignore
Deflect, attack, ignore facts, berate, and give people the High Hat.
Sound familiar?
I am glad you know yourself
I am glad you know yourself so well. I give you my consent to continue to be anonymously pecksniffian.
QUICK! TO WIKIPEDIA CONE OF KNOWLEDGE!
"I am glad you know yourself
Toby is now the Pee-Wee Herman of KnoxViews. 00:42 seconds in.
Tell you what. Continue to
Tell you what. Continue to stay out of this. You don't even have a clear position on the matter, Doug. It is just something for you to freak out about just like the Brownlow Building. Dire predictions there. None that came true.
1. Don't tell me what to do,
1. Don't tell me what to do, Toby. You have become a bully who attacks anyone who tries to post an evenly remotely opposing view. They may not have your education, or vocabulary, and when they don't, you delight in picking on them. See the entire thread above. When you get called on it, you attack. You are an abusive poster. Other people's communication skills are no reason to be a playground bully.
2. I worked my ass off to save Brownlow. There was no freaking out. I mowed the grass over there for two years, got consistent media attention to make sure the developers didn't walk away or let it fall down. (See two 11th Street Artist's houses that burned this weekend, McClung Warehouses, and McCallie School on Gratz for comparison, please.) Many others in the neighborhood worked their asses off to save the school, too. I personally caught two Fulton High School students who were trying to break in who were in a stolen Xterra involved in two hit and runs, who had previously stolen computers from Whittle Springs Middle. I then worked with the project manager, Danny Fielden, during months of construction to make sure break-ins didn't occur, tools didn't get stolen, and an open water main didn't flood. I sometimes closed up the building at night if one of the painters had left the door unlocked rather than make Danny come all the way back over. Faith and I have hosted parties for our new neighbors at Brownlow, and know many of them on a first-name basis.
3: Re TYP, my position has always been clear. Put as many chronic homeless in PSH as quickly and affordably as possible, and stop wasting time and money on elaborate projects like Minvilla and Flenniken. 90 percent of the people I talk to agree with me.
1. The people I 'attack'
1. The people I 'attack' deserve it. You are talking about people who want to keep the status quo, which is a human rights violation of the first order and completely undemocratic by virtue of its classist and exclusionary nature.
2. That's nice.
3. I'll bookmark this. IIRC, you also follow the reasoning that we "coddle" the homeless, which is why they flock to Knoxville.
The people I 'attack' deserve
wow.
You attack commenters who don't agree with you. They're not always right. Neither are you, who believes Knoxville should turn empty housing over to squatters--you've told me so. Good for you. There are others who don't agree with you. That doesn't make them bad people. Nor does advocating for different policies to manage a growing homeless population.
You attack people who have different views than yours. Where you could inform, you ridicule. not just once, but consistently. That's a bully.
Glad you finally admitted it.
Ah, the old "airing of a
Ah, the old "airing of a private conversation in public to score points." Keep it classy. I do think shelter is a human right and "squatting" is an expression of that right. Is it the best expression? No.
I have never said I am "right" about this. I have said that the TYP is problematic, but in very "fixable" ways. It is the best solution until a better one comes along. You hear, occasionally, among the TYPChoice bullshitters about starting over with a new plan. OK. I call your bluff. What's that plan look like? What are they thinking is the way to go?
You can score some more points if you'd like, Doug, but you've offered no meaningful objection to the TYP that the TYP hasn't been adjusted to or doesn't have the ability to address.
Yes. Minvilla has been a problem, but, if you actually talk to folks involved with this whole thing at the City, they will tell you that it has been a lesson learned.
BTW, you can't attack and
BTW, you can't attack and bully an anonymous poster, Doug. It's not a person. The reason they stay anonymous is because they are cowards. They don't want to be known as the person who writes the posts. There is no other answer. The word "bully" implies violence. If calling their bullshit "bullshit" is violent in your mind, then I think you should just calm down.
KAT schedule change
Just an fyi - the new route schedule eliminates service for Northshore at Lyons View (Lakeshore area). I don't think that Lakeshore, as a PSH site, was ever anything beyond an idea - never got as far as becoming a plan.
KAT achedule on Gleason rd
KAT achedule on Gleason rd also changed and the Teaberry Lane site WAS a Plan.
Teaberry was a prospective site
one of the earliest steps in developing a plan. Lots of new information will affect the "plan" in the early stages. sheesh.
"The topic will be mental
"The topic will be mental healthcare services in the context of permanent supportive housing."
Wonder if the TYP will talk about who will provide these services, where they will provided, and how they will be paid for?
Anybody, think about how Mercy's current financial situation may effect the Ten Year Plan?
Mercy
I imagine Mercy (and other hospitals) would be supporters of the TYP. A formerly chronically homeless person who is now housed, case managed, and signed up for applicable benefits would be a lot less likely to show up in their ER with no way to pay for it. In fact, the new federal homelessness plan, "Opening Doors," cites a study that says "During the year after entering supportive housing, formerly homeless persons in Portland, Maine experienced: ... 77% fewer inpatient hospitalizations ... 62% fewer emergency room visits ... 60% fewer ambulance transports ... 38% fewer psychiatric hospitalizations." [The ellipses are because I'm quoting from a sidebar table.] The other Portland, in Oregon, cites similar results, "58% fewer days in inpatient medical hospitalizations ... 87% fewer emergency room visits."
With those kinds of results, I'm betting hospitals like the idea of supportive housing.
With those kinds of results,
Given the way this debate is going, I'm betting they're skeptical.
The single biggest problem with our local TYP implementors is that they tend to do their own thing rather than build on working models. Try to find a Minvilla type expenditure in other Ten Year Plans.
According to a Knox County deputy, a relatively small number of chronically homeless cost the taxpayers the lions share of the statistical amount of expenditures. These folks are also least likely to be considered for PSH because of their anti-social tendencies, particularly when they've been drinking. My guess is that the hospitals know what is going on and have elected to remain silent rather than have their reputations sullied by "progressives." For what it's worth, the same deputy observed that most of these problems reside in West Knoxville.
Knoxvilles TYP plan is very broadly written. In the hands of creative, caring people that would put community, neighborhoods, and the needs of the homeless ahead of every dollar they could squeeze out of taxpayers, it could be a great thing. It is not in those hands. It's all about money and transference of assets with absolutely no accountability.
Peninsula and the TYP
Does anyone know why someone from Peninsula Hospital is speaking at the TYP Meeting Wednesday night?
Seems like they would have someone from Tenncare/Medicaid or Cherokee Health or Helen Ross McNabb. Especially considering CH & HRM are the providers of the Mental Health Services for the TYP, according to Jon Lawler.
Does Peninsula have anything to do with the TYP?
Peninsula, and correct me if
Peninsula, and correct me if I am wrong, has something to do with mental health. I could be wrong. Who knows? No one is being honest! It's a CORNSPIRACY!!!!
But don't they only know how
But don't they only know how to handle high-priced mental health issues?
It may be expensive care, but
It may be expensive care, but I suspect that Peninsula has lots of folks who can speak to providing care to the mentally ill. Just because someone will be there, doesn't mean that they are going to have anything to do with providing care.
M, Although we all enjoy your
M,
Although we all enjoy your witt, the question remains.
Does Peninsula Hospital, provide Mental Health services to the Ten Year Plan?
Sheryl McCormick, Coordinator, Recovery Training Services at Peninsula, is speaking tonight. What Role does she have in providing services at any of the Ten Year Plans PSH developments?
Seems like her role is to
Seems like her role is to speak at the meeting.
More pearls of wisdom from
More pearls of wisdom from the scatologist.
I still haven't figured out
I still haven't figured out why you are concerned? Do you live in Knox County?
Wow! something you haven't
Wow! something you haven't figured out,thats a new one, I never new you cared.
Do you support the practice
Do you support the practice of dumping Loudon County's homeless into Knox County?
Sheryl McCormick speaks
Sheryl McCormick speaks honestly about SPMI and is very relevant to the discussion. So was Cynthia Barker from an earlier meeting. It would be one thing if you honestly said that you don't want to help the homeless. It would be sad, but honest. Instead, you are using a mental illness is scary tactic that hurts the people who live with mental illness and those who care about them.
TYP Public Conversation Goals
According to the TYP Web Site:
So the question remains, what role does Ms. McCormick have in the TYP, or the plans for the delivery of Mental Health services in their Permanent Supportive Housing facilities?
These meetings are suppose to be in the context of the TYP's Facilities, and what the Public can expect.
Good Grief!
If you look in the phone book on page 347, you will see in the right hand corner that Peninsula provides "comprehensive alcohol/drug and mental health outpatient services for adults, adolescents and children."
TYP is proposing permanent supportive HOUSING not an institution with mental health and addiction counselors on site. I will reiterate that if anyone really wants to understand what is being proposed I will personally do whatever is necessary to facilitate a visit to current sites.
Ray Abbas
Mr. Abbas,
Mr. Abbas,
1) According to the TYP Web Site, as I said above:
To me, this means that anyone that is presenting information at one of these meetings should be one of the providers of services to the Plan. From the TYP's own statements about this above, why should the public expect anything else?
2) Your statement above:
"TYP is proposing permanent supportive HOUSING not an institution with mental health and addiction counselors on site."
Is really enlightening. According to the TYP, they consistantly discuss Successfull Housing First Programs, like Seattle, and Portland, and the New York City, Pathways programs as models of Housing First Success.
The Problem is, these programs in most of their facilities, do provide the Mental Health, Addiction Counceling, and other services on the sites of their Housing First Programs.
From the Pathways Website:
http://www.pathwaystohousing.org/content/housing_and_services
Mr. Abbas, if this is such a good model, why is the Knoxville Ten Year Plan, not going to do the same?
On PBS last night
On PBS last night, a history of the deinstitutionalization movement. It was very interesting to hear more about how it started in California, the lack of funding for adequate community care, the extraordinary level of parental involvement and advocacy, and how the movement spread across the country. For better AND worse, the deinstitutionalization movement was a huge contributor to the problems we're dealing with now.
The program ended with this statement: the largest psychiatric facility in the US is the LA County jail.
I am sure that you have run
I am sure that you have run across the little factoid in your research, Linda, that money available for housing projects has diminished at a rate proportional to the increase in funding for prisons in the US.
very powerful documentary
And very close to home for me. In the 1970's, doctor's had decided, based on "Dr Fraud", that mother's were the cause of schizophrenia in their children!
Can you imagine if we allowed Alzheimer's patients to simply "live on the street" or in our jails??? I doubt that we will see State Hospitals opening up more beds, so local communities are going to have to address this problem on their own nickle. Having a brain disorder should not be a crime...
When Medicine Got it Wrong - should be required viewing.
Welcome Other Interpretations
I want to be crystal clear in the fact that I don't speak on behalf of the TYP. With that said, I believe Peninsula has a role in the TYP as a service provider for mental health and addiction counseling and subsequently was asked to speak to the topic. I guess I am equally as confused as you are on why you DON'T think they play a role in the TYP. When the excerpt you refer to was written regarding the public conversations, I believe their intention was to open a broad dialogue about more than just bricks and mortar.
As far as the Pathways program you linked and the excerpt you provided is concerned, I don't interpret that to mean that the services are located on-site. I think they are just trying to make the point that they are very responsive to the needs of the residents. The fact that "teams are available on-call 24 hours a day, seven days a week and are provided in a participant’s natural environment— usually that persons’ apartment, neighborhood, or workplace" does not necessarily mean that they are located in the facility. However, I am open to other interpretations.
Ray Abbas
I am going to be unable to
I am going to be unable to attend this meeting tonight. I do hope that one (or several!) of you will post a report here on KV.
I'll link to ours.
We publish detailed reports of these public conversations on the TYP's website. They're tagged "public conversation." I'll post a link here at KV to tonight's as soon as I get it published, which will be sometime tomorrow.
Meeting last night
I won't do a full recap since Robert said he does that on the TYP site, but I will share what I took away from the meeting last night. I was moved by Jessica Bocangel's challenge (at the end of the meeting) to not fall into the habit of focusing only on the "illness", but rather to think about these issues in terms of mental "health" and am trying to change the way I think/speak about the subject.
Sheryl McCormick was a very informed and eloquent speaker to the issue of mental health services available to people in our area. She spoke from both a professional's perspective and then, very candidly about her own viewpoint as a person who experienced mental illness and even homelessness in her life.
Basically one-third of persons who experience mental health problems seek help. Stigma is a major reason why people don't seek treatment and labels such as "mentally ill" (and worse) create barriers to people seeking help. Sheryl also spoke about anosognosia (pronounced anna so nos ya), a term I had never heard before, which is basically a denial of or "an impaired awareness of illness." Sheryl talked about the varying levels of the recovery process from a remission of symptoms to complete recovery. Some common myths about mental illness were debunked. In fact, people who experience mental health problems are more likely to be the victims of violence than the perpetrators of it. Also, people CAN recover from mental illness.
A powerpoint slideshow outlined the continuum of mental health services (from hospitalization, mobile crisis unit, and short-term crisis stabilisation to an array of supports to help people out in the community) that are available to people in our area. Some services seemed to be available only to those with insurance or TennCare, but there were other services that helped create a safety net for those who may not have those resources to get the services they need. On a personal note, having worked in mental health and housing years ago, I was gratified that some of the ideas discussed years ago have been realized into mainstream programs that even get state funding (such as peer counseling programs).
There was some confusion, that later got clarification, about what of these many services were going to be available to residents of permanent supportive housing. At first it seemed that there was a disconnect between the services offered and who/how the services would be accessed, but Sheryl clarified that these services are available to ANYONE, resident of psh or not. The role of case management in linking the person to the needed service and resources was again detailed, as distinct from a more medical or treatment case management role at the mental health center. Depending upon a person's level of need, he/she may have more than one "case manager" on their support "team."
The issue of continued state funding for community mental health treatment was raised as a critical factor in being able to meet the needs of the community. I believe it's important to advocate and lobby for parity in funding for mental health services as with other medical services.
Both Sheryl and several others, including a doc from Peninsula (I didn't get her name), stressed the importance of stable housing being the key to stable mental health. Trying to stabilize people living on the street is an extremely difficult and expensive proposition because of the stressors people face just trying to survive in that lifestyle.
On that note, the Peninsula folks brought along a graphic display of photographs of the challenge people face living on the streets. It's hard for me to imagine how life on the streets could not help but lead to anxiety, depression, etc.
To wrap up, the information presented was thorough and clear. The speaker showed tremendous personal courage in sharing some of her personal journey with mental health. While there are a wide array of mental health services in our community providing a pretty full continuum of mental health care, we need to raise awareness to keeping it funded. There is a great deal of hope for people experiencing problems to recover and live a better life. And there are many caring people, like Sheryl, along the way.
very good recap - thank you!
*Some people are impaired by mental illnesses through no fault of their own (or their mother's).
*Mental illnesses can be treated successfully.
*Access to treatment is more likely if the person has an address and a secure place to sleep - and recovery involves lots of sleep. It is exhausting to deal with all the false signals the brain sends out in mental illnesses.
*The criminal justice system should not be the primary provider of mental health services. Having a debilitating illness should not be a crime. Personally, I can't understand why folks with mental illness are not protected, under the ADA, from being incarcerated for non-violent crimes (urinating in public, being psychotic in public, etc).
*The best money spend right now would be to provide PSH to as many folks as we can afford.
*I believe I understand the reasons for expensive new construction (access to federal funding); if we had a local source of money (underwriter, donor, philanthropy) that would permit more sensible and less-expensive use of existing housing stock, that might not be an issue.
*None of us knows what the future holds for us and we can only do what we can plan for today. And today there are people living on the street who could benefit from PSH and access to services to treat their illnesses. Status quo is not acceptable.
TYP Meeting tonight at the South Knox Community Center
Did I miss the announcement of this meeting on Knoxviews?
From the TYP Web Site:
The meeting is scheduled to start at 6:00 PM at the South Knox Community Center, 522 Old Maryville Pike.
I have a commitment tonight
I have a commitment tonight so can't attend. Would appreciate hearing from all as to what transpires.
I'll be there but I'll be
I'll be there but I'll be late. Have an MPC workshop that runs till 6:30.